Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

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Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

May 05, 2023, 02:44:07 am

I’ve read the posts about absorption versus compressor fridges trade offs, and I’m interested in hearing about the experiences of those who have taken the plunge and made the swap from the factory fridge to a compressor unit. Specific points are overall satisfaction, which model, power consumption under various conditions, ease of swap?

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #1 – May 05, 2023, 04:18:16 am

Hi Keith; I'm sure others will chime in. My 23 year old Dometic Royale can't last much longer and I've been considering going compressor. Only because I have 400 AH of lithium battery and 450 Watts of solar. 8 cubic feet of ref/freezer vs. 6 cubic feet of propane electric. The compressor fridges seem less expensive. Dometic DMC4081 RV Refrigerator, 8 cu. ft., RH | Camping World
Vitrifrigo Black 8.1 Cu. Ft. Right Swing Refrigerator with Freezer, DC Only | Vitrifrigo... also available.
The sizes are about the same as the gas fridge you have now. LD wired large size 12v wiring to the back of the fridge. Maybe 6 ga. wiring for a 12v 'fridge option perhaps (1999). So easy to hookup. Just blank off the propane connection. RonB

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #2 – May 05, 2023, 06:09:26 am

I have a friend with a different manufacture coach and the 12V compressor frige. He has a single solar panel and a couple of 12v house batteries. He cusses the day he went with the frig. It kills the batteries in about 6 hours. He can hear the compressor running at night, his complaining goes on and on. If it were me, I'd stick with gas unless I had a real battery bank and solar to handle it.

Jon

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #3 – May 05, 2023, 07:11:16 am

Keith-

Propane-electric is great if you are on the road a lot or boondock often. I spent most of my time on shore power.

My LD had the original Dometic propane-electric, fourteen years old when I bought it. It worked well for the three years I owned the coach.

In 2015 I bought a 2008 Class A, third owner, no solar, 220Ah of house batteries, no inverter. It came with a Norcold 8 cubic-foot propane-electric refrigerator. After several seasons of camping in hot weather the Norcold seemed to run warmer (inside) than I liked. I installed an APRV Fridge Defend system with exterior and interior fans. It gave me peace of mind against damage by high boiler temps, but helped only a little with the freezer and refrigerator compartment temperatures.

I decided to replace the cooling unit on the Norcold with a 120V compressor-driven version. I could have chosen the propane-electric cooling unit replacement. I did the work myself, inside the coach. I'm fairly sure I did a poor job installing the cooling unit, but in any case the refrigerator compartment did not cool as well as I had hoped. Note: According to reviews, many people are happy with their cooling unit replacements, whether propane-electric, 12V or 120V.

I'll skip the next part of the story, except to say that the modified Norcold was not suitable for further modification.

I ended up installing a Frigidaire 10 cubic-foot 120V residential refrigerator. Going down the road I powered the frig off a Bluetti EB70 "portable 120V power source." I could have run the generator, but chose not to do so.

Pros-
1) Quiet
2) Low power draw: 5A at 120V for startup, dropping quickly to 0.5A steady-state
3) Larger interior
4) Separate freezer and refrigerator compartment temperature controls (low-tech, though, as it's based on air blown from the freezer into the refrigerator)
5) No longer concerned about cooling unit damage from unlevel operation
6) For 120V unit, does not require 10 AWG or larger DC wiring to power the compressor (my coach only had 16 AWG to the refrigerator controls)
7) Fit through the entry door

Cons-
1) Puts heat inside the coach (top and exterior vents blocked off)
2) Must meet clearance requirements around the "box" to cool properly
3) For the 120V unit, requires some power source going down the road or boondocking
4) Must be installed so it will not fall out
5) For the Frigidaire in the Class A coach, unable to remove or adjust the refrigerator interior shelves without partial removal from the hole in which it was installed
6) I'm fairly sure the residential will not last as long as a typical propane-electric. On the other hand, it cost half or less than half of a new propane-electric.
7) Frigidaire specifically excludes RV installations from warranty coverage.

Overall, I was happy to have made the switch.

Mark H.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #4 – May 05, 2023, 10:25:58 am

Only experience I have is working on associated electrical problems on a rig so-equipped. Bottom line, the only way the owners ended up happy was by switching to a larger lithium battery bank and adding several more solar panels. This is the issue - your on-board propane energy storage is many, many times over the amount of 12V storage and replenishment at your disposal, even with a lot of expensive upgrades. So, even though the energy efficiency of a propane fridge is very low compared to a compressor model, unless you camp exclusively with hookups and use an inverter while traveling, a satisfactory 'upgrade' of the fridge will be an overall very expensive proposition.

Steve

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #5 – May 05, 2023, 11:12:56 am

I’m in the same boat as RonB, but with a much newer fridge. With 400ah of Lithium and 850 watts of Solar, have plenty to run a compressor fridge.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #6 – May 05, 2023, 11:47:16 am

We have used a compressor ice chest for over two years now. It isn't a true comparison to a larger compressor but it gives an idea of how a full-size compressor refrigerator would work.
Our LD has 560 watts of solar and 200-amp/hours of lithium batteries which have been fine for the ice chest and our other needs but there are times when the battery gets low (during overcast or rainy days) and has required a generator run twice.
A large compressor refrigerator is going to use much more power no matter how well it is insulated. I would want 700-800 watts of solar, or more, and an additional 200 amp/hours of lithium batteries or more to enable boondocking without having to run the generator often.
A compressor refrigerator is appealing due to its larger interior and, hopefully, greater cooling power but its power needs can be excessive without a significant electrical upgrade.

If you have been keeping track of my reported experimentation with the propane refrigerator over the past twenty years. I have tried many different fan and insulation 'improvements' to increase its efficiency, with some good results.
Positive results have been achieved by rebuilding the refrigerator cabinet, adding insulation, and the missing venturi baffle structure that Dometic shows in the Installation Manual. The venturi structure speeds the flow of cooling air over the condenser coils at the back of the refrigerator. LD didn't build the venturi into our refrigerator cabinet.

I installed an ARP with optional interior and exterior fans to improve cooling. They are the best fans I have tried so far with automatic operation of the exterior cooling fan control by the ARP and is only used in warmer conditions.
The ARP also monitors the refrigerator's boiler to ensure it doesn't overheat by turning the flame off when overheating is detected, excess heat can damage or destroy the refrigerator's capacity to cool.
With these modifications, the propane refrigerator works fine in hot conditions.

Larry

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #7 – May 05, 2023, 02:09:08 pm

Like Larry, I would probably replace my refrigerator with a propane/electric just like what has served me well so far. I would modify the baffles in back of the 'fridge to improve the airflow, and add the insulation he did. Thanks Larry!
A link to Larry's extensive comment: Refrigerator improvements

If I did go the electric compressor route, I would add more solar (not much room left on the roof), and another SOK 206. Just barely enough room for one more. That would require some re-work. Easier to remain with propane.
RonB

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #8 – May 05, 2023, 08:26:03 pm

After about 18 months, I'm still very happy with my Norcold Polar N8DC.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #9 – May 05, 2023, 09:56:37 pm

Hi Howard; Norcold Polar N8DC Refrigerator, 8 cu. ft – Online RV Supply That works out to about 200 AH per day. Of course that is running full bore.
About how many hours a day does yours run with about 95 degrees outside. And about how much at about 70 degrees outside at night. It would be nice to not worry about how level it is, and to have a more rapid response to putting warm food inside. Or when opening and closing often at meal time. With good solar the 8 amps listed, it is easy to accommodate, but cloudy, dim, or short days, or tree shadows is the problem. RonB

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #10 – May 06, 2023, 01:46:49 am

Would you share your choice of the Norcold over others?

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #11 – May 06, 2023, 10:54:02 am

What others have said about needing a solid array of solar and batteries is exactly right, but entirely possible.

We switched out our absorption fridge for a 3-way (12v/24v/120v) Dometic DMC2641 earlier this year. At that time, we also added 2x 330w solar panels and 2x 280ah custom-built lithium batteries with “Overkill” BMS, plus all the Victron gear to make it seamless and easy to monitor.

Our new Dometic DMC2641 was NOS (new old stock), I’m pretty sure it’s not made anymore. However, it was either that or convert our 20 year old fridge to 12v (I DID keep the old fridge to do that as a backup — I’m admittedly scared by a discontinued Dometic product that we bought. This was a gamble in my view).

Ours is a RB, the newer Dometic and Norcold fridges that stick out of the cabinet 3-4” don’t look like they’ll allow the bath door to close without cutting the door to make it bi-fold. The 2641 looks exactly like the original fridge and even accepted the original decorative panels.

We love it (no more wild temp swings because we dared to open the door, no more -8*F freezer with a 43*F fridge, no more rotating ice packs from freezer to fridge). It has a little more usable room (still rated as 6cuft) due to lack of fins at the back of the fridge interior. We’ve only had one trip with it so far, but when parked in our driveway for 3 days pre-trip (Solar only, as this was a test), it hardly seemed that the batteries noticed there was a fridge running. I’m talking SOC 90% in the morning with lights and fridge and a 53-quart Kohree fridge/freezer — we have 2 young kiddos to keep happy — running all night for the driveway test.

This was the inverter also running: the RV fridge and the Kohree were both running on 120v AC.

We also had a DC-DC charger and a 3000w inverter installed at the same time. We have run our A/C on two 3-hour highway trips, during full sun + the DC-DC charger replacing some charge at the same time, and have a SOC 70-75% at arrival to the destination. ONLY saying this so that my statement that the fridge doesn’t drain the battery has some context.

If our camping style changes, I’d add another panel and/or battery before going back to absorption. Never thought I’d say that. I’m a convert.

Hope this adds useful info/limited experience and context to the discussion.

Jason

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #12 – May 06, 2023, 03:08:33 pm

"He has a single solar panel and a couple of 12v house batteries. He cusses the day he went with the frig."

That setup was doomed from the start—doomed by the RV’s maker. Many RV manufacturers trumpet "SOLAR EQUIPPED!" when all they've installed is a single hundred-watt panel and a couple of cheap lead-acid batteries. Your friend’s rig should have been built with either a propane/120 V fridge, or a lot more solar panels and batteries. 400 watts and 400 amp-hours is a good round number for an RV-sized compressor fridge.

I've had compressor fridges in four RVs, plus several trucks and cars, and have been very happy with them. But I didn't stint on solar panels or batteries.

I installed a Vitrifrigo DP150 in my Lazy Daze midbath. It held 5.3 cubic feet--less than the Dometic 3662 fridge it replaced--but I travel solo, so that capacity was plenty big enough for me. The advantage of the smaller size was that I could surround the fridge with four inches of rigid foam insulation, so it was much more efficient. (Lazy Daze's insulation on my 2003 rig was a pathetic one inch of styrofoam, loosely glued in place, with gaps around the edges of the pieces.) I installed 600 watts of solar panels on the roof, and about 450 amp-hours of AGM batteries, and didn't have problems with power.

On my first Airstream trailer, a 27-footer, I installed the same DP-150 fridge. The electrical setup was about the same: 600 watts of solar panels and about 400 Ah of LiFePO4 batteries. Again, no shortage of power.

My 13' Trillium trailer came with a small (about two and a half cubic foot) Dometic compressor fridge/freezer. I installed a 160 amp-hour LiFePO4 battery and used 200 watts of portable solar panels, and had no problems for the seven months (spring/summer/fall) that I spent in that rig. In wintertime I might have added another 200 W of portable panels.

My current 19' Airstream trailer was typical of what I said earlier: it came with a single 100 watt solar panel, an inefficient PWM solar controller, and a pair of small (group 24) flooded lead-acid batteries--barely enough to get from one KOA to the next (not my style!), and completely inadequate for any kind of boondocking. I replaced the factory-installed Dometic propane/120 V fridge (about three fourths the size of a typical RV fridge) with a Vitrifrigo C130 4.7 cubic foot compressor fridge, and I installed 320 amp-hours of LiFePO4 batteries. I've been using 200 to 400 watts of portable panels (the higher wattage in winter), but am in the process of installing 380 watts on the roof. Again, I'm not running out of power.

I also have a 1.5 cubic foot Dometic CFF45 compressor chest fridge in my truck. It's powered by a 140 watt solar panel on the roof of the truck’s topper, which feeds a 105 amp-hour group 27 AGM battery. So far, that outfit has never run short of power, even during cloudy stretches of several days. It's great to have a 24/7 fridge in the truck--handy for grocery shopping trips, keeps cold drinks always on hand, and acts as auxiliary storage for the smallish fridge in the Airstream.

I’ve been happy with all my compressor fridges, and would never go back to propane. But as others have pointed out, adequate electrical power is a must, and if you’re starting with a typical, minimal RV electrical system, that can be a substantial investment. Compressor refrigeration is not for everyone, but it has worked great for me.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #13 – May 06, 2023, 06:03:45 pm

Reading over my previous post, there's nothing I'd change. Fortunately, I still haven't had the refrigerator in really hot weather.

I picked the Norcold because, at the time, it was available. A Nova Kool took 16-17 weeks to get. A Vitrifrigo was available, but only the AC/DC model. The Norcold has separate temperature controls for the refrigerator and freezer. Nova Kool can do this too, but only with the dual compressor model, which is more expensive and heavier. Perhaps most important, every RV technician in the US has heard of Norcold. I figured it would be easier to get service and parts, which fortunately hasn't been needed so far.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #14 – May 06, 2023, 06:27:00 pm

Quote from: Andy Baird - May 06, 2023, 03:08:33 pm

I installed a Vitrifrigo DP150 in my Lazy Daze midbath. It held 5.3 cubic feet--less than the Dometic 3662 fridge it replaced--but I travel solo, so that capacity was plenty big enough for me. The advantage of the smaller size was that I could surround the fridge with four inches of rigid foam insulation, so it was much more efficient. (Lazy Daze's insulation on my 2003 rig was a pathetic one inch of styrofoam, loosely glued in place, with gaps around the edges of the pieces.) I installed 600 watts of solar panels on the roof, and about 450 amp-hours of AGM batteries, and didn't have problems with power.

My original exposure to 12-volt compressor refrigerators for RVs was in a boat. It had a remote compressor and was plumbed to the evaporator located in a custom-built refrigerator that had almost 6" of insulation. The owner said it used very little power, helped by the thick insulation and a tight-fitting door. The components used were similar to the ones shown on the links below.
CU-100 Air-Cooled ColdMachine Compressor | West Marine
ColdMachine VD-150 Small Vertical Evaporator | West Marine

While I have not seen this done in an LD yet, it is possible to buy separate components and build your own super-efficient compressor refrigerator.
We will probably stick with the propane refrigerator and continue carrying the 40-qt compressor food ice chest. The ice chest offers either as another refrigerator or a fast-acting freezer, used when we find a deal on fish or other foods.

Larry

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #15 – May 09, 2023, 12:40:39 am

We have used a Bodega 64 qt compressor 12v “cooler”. We kept it on freezer (both halves).

Yup need more electricity, used about 4-5
Amps all the time - outside temps were no hotter than 80 ever.

We added a bunch of meat to it at one point and it took a couple days to freeze it, but was then frozen hard (we kept the temp at -4 but our temperature sensor said it was 10 degrees).
I have no idea the propane refrigerator does this - we never added more than 5 lbs in at a time.

We also found that if it lost electricity it dropped temperature quickly, much quicker than stated. If I remember right it rose to 50 in about 5 hours. Many items were still frozen or mostly frozen though.

I agree with needing more solar/batteries if you are boondocking.

Re: Experience with compressor refrigerators in LDs

Reply #16 – May 17, 2023, 12:53:28 am

Sorry I missed this earlier,
My Dometic 2652 died a few years ago. We used it as an ice cooler for a bit and decided to try the JC 12V DC Compressor as it was about the same price as repairing the gas. I have upgraded the system with Victron components so I have a log of all my electrical usage. I have installed 315W of solar, 450 AHr lead battery bank and in the PWN it is not quite enough. I have found the the cooling unit turns on 16-20 times a day pulling 9 amps for 9 minutes. There is an internal circulating fan running drawing another half an amp continuously. So just for the refrigeration I find myself needing 250-300 Amp-Hr/per day with the solar array only getting up to 250Watts for about 3 hours in the spring. I have a separate alternator to charge the system providing >100 amps at idle and 200 amps while driving. I am still trying to figure out how much more battery bank I will require for a remote office but it definitely needs to be LiFePO4 for the faster charging rate and usable battery capacity. I did not need as much with a propane option.

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