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Topic: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue) (Read 642 times) previous topic - next topic
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Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
I just returned after a two week stay (volunteering) at the Albuquerque International Balloon Fiesta (which will now be referred to as the "Trip from Hades").

Even though I drove just 224 miles from Las Cruces (and had the tires aired and checked at Discount Tire the morning I left, one front valve extender came loose and the other snapped (front of rig) and I sat for 3 1/2 hours on the side of I-25 waiting for road service.  Road service changed to the spare on the completely flat tire and aired up the other tire so I could get to Discount Tire in Los Lunas (which I could see from the side of the road on I-25).

The shorter version is I went to A-B tire in Albuquerque (which I highly recommend) where they don't do extenders but add all in one piece brass stems to allow you to add your TPMS caps.  I have a Borg extender set on my rear duallies (which they checked to find that I didn't have a rubber stabilizer to keep the stems in place properly and added them). 

Needless to say, I'm "done" with Discount Tire. 

However, my next rant (if you're counting) is I need help with is the wheel well flaps coming up on the highway.  I did go back through the archives and read the posts.  The flap attaches vertically from the bottom.   I have washers at the top, then self locking (?) ones where I insert the skirt, then the wing nut screw on the bottom.  It was pretty windy on my way home after pulling over to the side of road a couple of times, I finally stopped in Socorro and used Gorilla Duct Tape to tape the flap to the side of the rig.  (Yes, I know the paint but I'm planning on having it repainted soon.)

Some (most) that I see now have a horizontal knob on the outside, and a couple of people I spoke with at the Balloon Fiesta said you can buy them from the factory.  Mari Cassanova lives near the factory and they actually drilled the hole for her and attached the knob, etc...  Obviously I'm not going to do that but will order the knob and have someone drill a hole for me locally.  I called yesterday to try and make sure this could be done, but Todd was on vacation. 

I need to get this fixed as it's "draining" to keep looking in my mirrors to make sure that they are flying up while I on the Interstate, and am always nervous with traffic flying past me while I tighten them on the side of the road. 

Sorry, for the rant - but would love suggestions...

Cheryl



Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #1 –
Hello Cheryl.   I’m so sorry that you’re having trouble with your much loved Lazy Daze.   I know you work diligently to keep her in excellent condition.  It sounds like you’ve successfully sorted the valve stem issue so check that off the list.   The tire skirts are another matter and I wish I could offer you some suggestions.  Perhaps you could post a couple of pictures of these tire skirts since our LD has skirt knobs.  I know you’ll get this sorted out just like you always do. 
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #2 –
Every LD I have seen, going back to the early 80’s, had a knob or wing it securing securing the rear wheel covers, post a few photos so we can see what is wrong.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #3 –
Quote from: Larry W  - 
Every LD I have seen, going back to the early 80’s, had a knob or wing it securing securing the rear wheel covers, post a few photos so we can see what is wrong.

Larry
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #4 –
"I have a Borg extender set on my rear duallies (which they checked to find that I didn't have a rubber stabilizer to keep the stems in place properly and added them)."
---
From my observations and hearing reports from a few people, leaving the rubber stabilizing grommets off when long stems are installed on the duals is not unusual. If the installer is unfamiliar with long valves and/or doesn't read or pay attention to the instructions and/or doesn't grasp what the stabilizer does, the grommet is often dumped with the packing material! Installing the long valves correctly is not a head-breaker, but it does require putting the RTFM process into play and engaging one's brain before doing the job. Tire shops usually have a lot of employee turnover, and workers may be unskilled, untrained, and inadequately supervised. Additionally, the rig owner needs to understand the installation process, not assume that the installation was done correctly, and check the work before accepting the job.

RE: The flapping skirts. Per the other responding posts, every LD I've ever seen has two threaded "shafts" from the rig body (under the fender skirt) and either wing nuts or a knobs to secure each end of the skirt to the body. Could a previous owner have cut off the threaded shafts?

YMMV, as always.

2003 TK has a new home
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #5 –
Quote from: Joan  - 
RE: The flapping skirts. Per the other responding posts, every LD I've ever seen has two threaded "shafts" from the rig body (under the fender skirt) and either wing nuts or a knobs to secure each end of the skirt to the body. Could a previous owner have cut off the threaded shafts?

Thanks for replying Joan...  I added some photos to the original post.  No matter what I do, they usually come loose after driving down the road - especially if it's windy.  I heard someone say there's a modification they can do drilling a horizontal hole and attaching knobs from the factory.  It a major concern for me as it becomes a safety issue when I'm tightening the wing nut on the size of the road with traffic whizzing by...  It looks like the paint job (the white bluish color) isn't the only thing that was overlooked on the 1998 models.
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #6 –
Quote from: Ed & Margee  - 
Perhaps you could post a couple of pictures of these tire skirts since our LD has skirt knobs.  I know you’ll get this sorted out just like you always do.

Aw thanks - it's just frustrating...  I added photos to the original post.
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #7 –
OK, now I get it; maybe other owners with mid-late 90s rigs might comment on this problem and offer solutions?

2003 TK has a new home
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #8 –
I use two fender washers and two flat rubber washers on each of the four hold down studs. Rubber washers sandwich the fender skirt, snug everything down and I haven't had a problem.

Jon
1994 MB
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #9 –
On my 96, the fender skirt cracked around one of the wing nuts. I tried using larger washers and that worked for awhile.
Eventually, the cracked skirt had nothing to secure left.
It finally flapped long enough to break away. I contacted the factory, got another skirt and the newer securing system.
Installed them on both sides and haven't had a problem since.
Jota
96 23.5 FL
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #10 –
Our 99 MB had the traditional knobs to hold down the wheel covers. Very strange!

George & Jo Ann
2017 MB
George & Jo Ann
2017 MB
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #12 –
Quote from: Jota  - 
On my 96, the fender skirt cracked around one of the wing nuts. I tried using larger washers and that worked for awhile.
Eventually, the cracked skirt had nothing to secure left.
It finally flapped long enough to break away. I contacted the factory, got another skirt and the newer securing system.
Installed them on both sides and haven't had a problem since.

The bottom attachment is starting to crack and widen a "smidge" at the semi circle.  Todd is out this week on vacation, but I'm calling on Monday for the new horizontal screws with the knobs.
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #13 –
Quote from: Jota  - 
I contacted the factory, got another skirt and the newer securing system.
Installed them on both sides and haven't had a problem since.

Since I'm having someone do this for me in Las Cruces, did the "new securing system" come with a diagram and/or instructions?
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #14 –
I’ve ordered a few parts from the Factory and none contained Factory instructions or diagram.  You might ask for some help when you call to “arrange” your order.  Perhaps even a handwritten sketch?   It’s a least worth asking for installation guidance. 
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #15 –
Quote from: Ed & Margee  - 
You might ask for some help when you call to “arrange” your order.  Perhaps even a handwritten sketch?   It’s a least worth asking for installation guidance.

Thanks, good idea!
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #16 –
Quote from: JonS  - 
I use two fender washers and two flat rubber washers on each of the four hold down studs. Rubber washers sandwich the fender skirt, snug everything down and I haven't had a problem.

This is how our 1983 LD’s wheel covers were secured, rubber washers were the fix.
Since the covers seldom need to be removed, replacing the wing nuts with nyloc lock
nuts would prevent the nuts from backing off, they are available at any hardware store.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #17 –
Quote from: Larry W  - 
This is how our 1983 LD’s wheel covers were secured, rubber washers were the fix.
Since the covers seldom need to be removed, replacing the wing nuts with nyloc lock
nuts would prevent the nuts from backing off, they are available at any hardware store.

It looks like I'm off to the hardware store today.  I did include photos to the original post to show the issue. 
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #18 –
mine flapped around while on a highway. In the pinch I duck taped around the "whole" on the flap to make it more padded and cut just a line for the screw to fit between the tape and the wing nut was able to hold better.

About to do a more permanent solution, but not sure yet. glad you're starting this thread!

Also discount tire broke one of my screws which seems impossible to replace so the wing nut is barely holding on........
1995 23.5 Rear Lounge
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #19 –
"I use two fender washers and two flat rubber washers on each of the four hold down studs."

That's a bit of overkill AFAIC. I used only one fender washer per stud (total 4) and no rubber washers. The difference being that my fender washers are made of nylon and somewhat thicker than a standard metal fender washer. As I recall, I had to enlarge the hole to fit over the studs. They have been in service now for the better part of 17 years without issue.  ::)   ;)
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #20 –
Cheryl,
My' 88 MB has your style of skirt closure.  I do a fender washer above the skirt, a rubber washer and Fender washer below the skirt and tighten the wing nut.  The rubber washer will work the same as a lock washer.
After 30+ years my screws have enough Tar, grime and rust the wing nuts do not vibrate loose.

As for Discount Tire and Americas Tire,  they are strictly a passenger car tire center.  After two sets of RV tire sets at America's Tire, I use a more truckish tire stores.  The last one I used was Big O. 

As for tire valve extensions, The more parts that are spinning around at on the wheel,  The more parts to break! 
I use standard stems with Hex caps.  I carry a socket and 1/4" x12 extension to remove the caps. A straight dual chuck tire inflator tool with gauge.  I can check the tire pressure with the inflator tool just like a tire gauge, Just don't squeeze the valve lever with out an air hose, it will let air out of the tire. No after market tire pressure monitor system,  More stuff to break!
Rodney
1988 Mid Bath
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #21 –
I went to Lowe's and had a conversation with an employee and showed him photos on my phone.  The attached photo shows the progression of securing the wheel flap from top to bottom.  I wasn't comfortable using the wing nut again and decided upon the recommendation of a "stop" nut.  I also bought  a 7/16 in. Flex Head Ratcheting Combination Wrench to make the tightening (and un-tightening) easier. 

Thanks everyone for your advice and help...

Cheryl
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #22 –
Well, I think I showed Ted or Tracy and Anthony my method of fixing your flapping wheel cover problem at AIBF. I also didn't like losing the wing nut in the dark by the side of the road. (Early on)
In my case the factory didn't get the cover's piano hinge in the right place. Tightening the screw just compressed the wheel covers, and made them bow away from the side of the mh, which looked pretty inept to people who noticed.
   I replaced the 1/4-20 screws with longer ones, tightened them down with locktite. Welded a washer onto a nut (tricky with thin stainless). I lock-tited that washer/nut where it needed to be. A loose washer, then wingnut. A collar at the bottom end red locktited, prevents the wing nut from coming off and getting lost. No side knobs, no drilling holes. Invisible almost. The wing nuts can be very tight, the flaps don't come loose and flap.    I'm sorry you didn't see that in Albuquerque. It is documented on this site with pics, but my laptop is at home, just my phone here in Laughlin.
  Yes, some of the techs at Discount Tire are clueless, and worse some don't realize it. I also showed Ted, (I think) at Albuquerque the install of my flow through TST tpms sensors, involving my flex hose extensions. (WheelMaster) Installing those isn't as trivial as it appears, but I haven't had problems with mine except when Discount Tire gets hold of them. They paid for new parts and the labor. RonB
  
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #23 –
Quote from: RonB  - 
Well, I think I showed Ted or Tracy and Anthony my method of fixing your flapping wheel cover problem at AIBF. I also didn't like losing the wing nut in the dark by the side of the road. (Early on)
I'm sorry you didn't see that in Albuquerque. It is documented on this site with pics, but my laptop is at home, just my phone here in Laughlin.
Yes, some of the techs at Discount Tire are clueless, and worse some don't realize it. I also showed Ted, (I think) at Albuquerque the install of my flow through TST tpms sensors, involving my flex hose extensions. (WheelMaster) Installing those isn't as trivial as it appears, but I haven't had problems with mine except when Discount Tire gets hold of them. They paid for new parts and the labor. RonB

I'm sorry I didn't get to see your configuration to solve the flapping problem, but I had limited time to visit as I volunteered as a Navigator for the Balloon Fiesta.  What I have done seems to be working for now and I might eventually have the knob modification, as using the ratchet tool takes a bit of time.  I've learned my lesson and now will only use Discount Tire for my auto (CR-V) tires.  
Cheryl (a.k.a. Desert Diva)
1998 Lazy Daze (26.5 mid-bath)
2002 Honda CR-V
 
Re: Wheel Well Flaps (1998 Mid-Bath Vertical Screws Issue)
Reply #24 –
Hi Cheryl;  I have previously posted this photo (somewhere here). This shows what works for me. The same really as what came with my rig, but a longer screw. Washers to spread the clamping force, and a collar to prevent the wing nut from falling off. All stainless steel of course.  No other mods or drilling needed.  I don't have the side knobs, but if they come off, they can still disappear  (ok, they are bigger and harder to misplace).   RonB      That was Wheel Cover "Flap" and Wing Nuts?
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB