Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

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April 14, 2018, 09:52:16 pm

I was reading some threads in the general forum that led me to go look at the available models on the LD site- did they really stop making 22' and MP models? If so, why?!

I LOVE my 22'. I have barely driven it, but can't imagine driving anything larger. And why stop offering the MP? It's perfect for the small bodies as it gives two separate seating areas and some privacy between the two. I was in mine today and closed the accordion door, leaving my dogs in the front while I hung out in the lounge in the back. What's not to love?!

Why would they stop offering either of those things?

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #1 – April 15, 2018, 01:12:19 am

Quote from: meandthedogs link=msg=186273 date=1523757136 Why would they stop offering either of those things? [/quote

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I'm guessing it's like most business decisions--not enough sales of that model meant it made no sense to continue building...after all, they only build what people order. My dad was in real estate for nearly 40 years (mostly ag properties) and his rule of thumb was that the value of something is determined by what a buyer will pay (which is not necessarily what the seller has invested--either financially or emotionally). If buyers aren't paying, it makes no sense to build.

Joan's mantra--YMMV--rings true once again. I love my TB, but it's not a popular model & I'm thankful I found it when I did/

Lynne

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #2 – April 15, 2018, 02:41:09 am

Hi Lynne, and Lisa The 22' is alive and well. The Chevy chassis had a shorter snout, the engine was more in between the driver and passenger. The box that Lazy Daze built made the total 22' The same box mounted by LD on the Ford chassis, was 23 feet 4 1/2 inches. The snout was longer, the hood bigger, and less engine was between the driver and passenger. The V10 engine was probably longer than the 460 CID V8. In about 2008 (someone who knows can chime in here) The front was made even longer. The 23.5 became 24', the 26.5 became 27' and the 30.5 became 31' The boxes stayed essentially the same for all models. The Multiplan IIRC was a custom selection of pieces of floorplan i.e. two barrel chairs and a table vs. a dinnette. Or a kitchen moved from one spot to a different location. I think the speculation here was that too many floorplan options made it more difficult to build and keep track of for the factory. They eliminated the least popular of the options, and firmed up the most popular layouts as the only ones they offer now. I think that came about in the early '90's. Some of these plans may still be available as 'stealth' options if you talk a good case to Steve. Shifting tastes for buyers, when enough people ask for the same thing, may be one of the ways new floor plans happen. RonB

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #3 – April 15, 2018, 05:01:51 pm

Thanks for that! Was just thinking for the future, i.e. if I win the lottery and want a brand new 22'!

As for the lengths depending on chassis type- so that means my 91 on a Chevy G30 is 1.5' shorter than the same house built on a Ford? If so, I like that advantage. I know the engine is supposed to suck in terms of power, but still prefer the shortest possible RV with as much living space inside. So I reiterate my contention that the 22' MP is the best configuration ever. Particularly if you live or plan to travel in urban areas.

I love the separate spaces despite the small size. LOVE. IT!

Lisa

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #4 – April 15, 2018, 06:07:03 pm

Different strokes for different folks. Pleasureway makes a B+ that’s 22 feet long and likely a skitch narrower than an LD. May be the ticket for you. Twin beds in the back can be made up into a huge bed and it has all the latest gizmos many seem to covet such as lithium batteries.

The Pleasure-Way Plateau XLTD - Pleasure-Way Industries

Dave

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #5 – April 15, 2018, 06:38:42 pm

"Different strokes for different folks. Pleasureway makes a B+ that's 22 feet long and likely a skitch narrower than an LD. May be the ticket for you. Twin beds in the back can be made up into a huge bed and it has all the latest gizmos many seem to covet such as lithium batteries."

I make no secret that there is a substantial lust in my heart for a Pleasure-Way . . . BUT . . . I stack up the cost/usability/quality/floorplan with a Lazy Daze . . . and it is NO CONTEST. I wish I had back the hours I have spent trying to justify a Pleasure-Way of a similar length to even a Lazy Daze TK, and it just keeps coming up short.

Starting at the cost point, it is easy to make a comparison. I looked at the Pleasure-Way units that would sell for about the current value of my 2005 RB, and asked myself "Would I trade them even?". The answer was always "Are you kidding?".

If money were no object, then the Sportsmobile would be replaced in a flash by a Pleasure-Way as our auxiliary unit, but there is no contest in my mind about the comparative value of the two brands - Pleasure-Way and Lazy Daze. The floorspace is exceedingly limited in a Pleasure-Way; one smallish person, and one smallish dog/cat/goldfish/goldfinch/Guinea pig, etc., might do okay, but two long-legged dogs with even just one occupant would be a really, really tight squeeze.

The Pleasure-Way (and Roadtreks, etc.) look very spacious in the photos, but being inside is a whole different experience. One prominent couple on this board is now happily in a Leisure Travel unit, so perhaps they will weigh in on how it feels compared to their Lazy Daze unit(s).

Virtual hugs,

Judie

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #6 – April 15, 2018, 07:03:26 pm

Quote from: meandthedogs - April 15, 2018, 05:01:51 pm

As for the lengths depending on chassis type- so that means my 91 on a Chevy G30 is 1.5' shorter than the same house built on a Ford? If so, I like that advantage.

Yes, but 2003 and after have a wider coach (~4"), which translates into more aisle space in most of the smaller floorplans.

Steve

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #7 – April 16, 2018, 10:04:01 am

Quote from: Judie Ashford - April 15, 2018, 06:38:42 pm

One prominent couple on this board is now happily in a Leisure Travel unit, so perhaps they will weigh in on how it feels compared to their Lazy Daze unit(s).

I think I know who you are referring to and I would be interested in hearing a comparison of the two brands.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #8 – April 16, 2018, 11:26:37 am

It always comes back to usage characteristics: drive vs camp. The more you drive, the more you'll value car-like handling & driving behavior, with size/comfort taking second priority. However, the more you camp, the more you'll prioritize comfort & amenities, with ease of use becoming less important.

This sliding scale works beyond the standard class B vs class C analysis as well. If you're really *into* driving, as in road trip!, then having a nice car and dealing with hotels along the way becomes the standard option. Tens of millions upon tens of millions of Americans and foreign tourists do this each year.

On the other hand, if you're really into staying put - say like a campground host - then trailer/5W becomes the norm. It may be a hassle to hitch up & tow, but once firmly settled - for maybe weeks at a time - it's like having a second home.

I'm more of a road trip! guy, so I actually tend more towards hotels. However, my wife hates super long drives, which is why our drive trips have moved to Europe. There, you can drive 3-4 hours and be in a completely different country, so you get more variety. She swears she's over the 10-12 hour drives from say, St George through Zion, and then on to the GC, with a 100 mile (r/t) detour to the N rim, then on to Flagstaff & Sedona. LOL

But yeah, the class B Roadtrek's are sure nice if you like to get up and go each day.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #9 – April 16, 2018, 12:56:34 pm

Quote from: snerf - April 16, 2018, 11:26:37 am

It always comes back to usage characteristics: drive vs camp. The more you drive, the more you'll value car-like handling & driving behavior, with size/comfort taking second priority. However, the more you camp, the more you'll prioritize comfort & amenities, with ease of use becoming less important.

I may be an exception but find driving the LD is more relaxing than driving a car, on long trips.
The slower speeds, along with a comfortable captains chair works fine for me.
When the weather turns bad, the LD does well, sitting up high provide a better view down the road when the spray is road spray is flying.
And when we really feel like taking a drive, we unhook the Jeep. It's a lot more fun to drive than any van.

Larry

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #10 – April 17, 2018, 10:40:59 am

The types of cars that have really made driving a whole new level of fun are CUVs. Any vehicle based on a standard sedan, but lifted with more glass and headroom, provides better comfort & visibility. My wife used to have an RX350, but didn't like the new model, so she got a GLC300. Channeling Tuco from Breaking Bad: tight, tight, tight!

Wagons work as well - last year, I drove an A4 station wagon from Rome to Florence and back via Tuscany. This year, we're renting a 3 series wagon for a Munich-Vienna-Prague-Munich spin. I was in love with the A4 when we returned, but it's just too small and low in the US. We ended up getting the new JLU Rubicon, but of course it's not a road car. For that, we kept our Sienna.

If I won the lottery, I think I would get a RoadTrek Sprinter. Financially, they just don't make a lot of sense, but if money was no object, then it would be my preferred choice.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #11 – April 17, 2018, 11:34:59 am

Quote from: snerf - April 17, 2018, 10:40:59 am

Wagons work as well - last year, I drove an A4 station wagon from Rome to Florence and back via Tuscany.

Agreed, we love our Subaru Outback on long trips!

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #12 – April 17, 2018, 11:37:36 am

"If I won the lottery, I think I would get a RoadTrek Sprinter"

Like Lazy Daze vs. Thor . . . brand quality should be investigated thoroughly. The horror stories I have read on Facebook from Roadtrek owners are frightening.

Virtual hugs,

Judie <-- Sierra Vista, Arizona
Adventures of Dorrie Anne | Photographing the West

Today: Midwestern Mexican with Southern Tier Collards
****************************************************

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #13 – April 17, 2018, 12:18:22 pm

I quit looking at Sprinters after reading this, I think just Google Fatal flaw Sprinters
Just the regular ongoing maintenance costs seem way too high for us

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #14 – April 17, 2018, 01:47:57 pm

Quote from: Tiger (Clark) - April 17, 2018, 12:18:22 pm

I quit looking at Sprinters after reading this, I think just Google Fatal flaw Sprinters
Just the regular ongoing maintenance costs seem way too high for us

To be fair, the author issues a bunch of caveats.

Chris

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #15 – April 17, 2018, 08:40:00 pm

Quote from: HiLola - April 16, 2018, 10:04:01 am

I would be interested in hearing a comparison of the two brands.

They aren't that easy to compare. Completely different chassis. We closely weighed a used LD vs the LTV we now have (downsized from a Foretravel DP that was the coach we upsized to from the LD). We wanted 2 possible sleeping/lounging areas and NOT an overhead bunk. Our current needs are for a shorter coach than the 30 footer we had (and loved). That pretty much precluded any of the LD floorplans, but it in no way is an indication that we wouldn't have bought LD if we had found one that worked for our needs. We also have a 13 year gap between owning a LD and buying our LTV, so with the fade of memories, it's not fair to contrast and compare. We loved our LD. We loved our FT. We love our LTV. It's all in what's the right coach for your needs.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #16 – April 20, 2018, 02:01:16 am

Quote from: Judie Ashford - April 17, 2018, 11:37:36 am

"If I won the lottery, I think I would get a RoadTrek Sprinter"

Like Lazy Daze vs. Thor . . . brand quality should be investigated thoroughly. The horror stories I have read on Facebook from Roadtrek owners are frightening.

Ha! The same week I got my LD, my brother bought a 1996 Roadtrek to drive from OR to CD with his wife, with a detour down the West Coast. He had quite a few issues along the way. They stayed in their van in my driveway and it seemed so, so small. I would love the maneuverability, but not that inside set up. The shower is in the middle of the van! How's that supposed to work?

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #17 – April 20, 2018, 09:51:36 am

Look at the Roadtrek site. You can download past floor plans. Typically it is a wet bath, the shower sprays on the toilet and sink. The bath is also the closet. the doors open into the walkway, the walk way has a sunken pan that drains to gray tank. A shower curtain loops into the hall way and back into the closet to contain the over spray.

I have a 1991Coachman M-19 RB/VT(Rear Bath with mid high roof and Full size slide out bunk, 19') with a sit down bath tub/shower, and a 1988 MB(26'). Two people(6'5" and 5'-3"tall) and a 85 pound dog. I take the LD hands down.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #18 – May 28, 2018, 11:16:45 am

The Chevy small block engine (350 ci/5.7L) gets a bad rap around here, at least the 1987+ fuel injection version. Reality is that the 350 TBI (throttle body injection) is one of the most reliable engines Chevy ever built. They routinely go 250-300k, just look at trucks of that vintage. We are at 140k in our LD and it runs like a top. The fuel injection system is rudimentary and leaves power on the table, but it's simplicity means it just keeps ticking.

Huge difference between fuel injection and carburetion. Carburetors cannot adjust for altitude, fuel injection does automatically. Take a carb calibrated for sea level up to 10,000 feet, it will barely run, being incredibly rich. Too much fuel in the engine washes oil off the cylinder walls and causes damage, too much fuel keeps burning in the exhaust manifold, burning valves and cracking manifolds, all issues blamed on the 350. The problem is really carburetion.

We find our 350 equipped 1989 amazingly capable. It lives in Colorado and tackles some of the most brutal climbs around routinely- the million dollar highway, Wolf Creek Pass, just about every other highway pass in Colorado- clinbs of 5000-8000 vertical feet, up to 12,000 feet elevation. It climbs very well even with the little engine, and gets gas milage most RV's can't touch at 10-12mpg. We are often pulling jet skis on a trailer, so adding another 2000 lbs of weight in. It never runs warm and is staggeringly good at maintaining speed. I wouldn't realise it wasn't a big block just by driving it.

I would not pull a toad using a 350. But, part of the fun of having a 22' is you don't really need one. You can park and drive it easily, and the fuel economy is decent.

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #19 – July 01, 2018, 06:52:42 pm

Quote from: Tiger (Clark) - April 17, 2018, 12:18:22 pm

I quit looking at Sprinters after reading this, I think just Google Fatal flaw Sprinters
Just the regular ongoing maintenance costs seem way too high for us

We have a 2014 Winnebago Sprinter that has been less reliable than we'd like ( both the coach and the chassis ). We are seriously considering selling it and buying a 24' LD.

--Charlie Jordan
middle TN

Re: Does LD no longer make 22' or MP models?

Reply #20 – July 02, 2018, 02:25:51 pm

Quote from: cj11363 - July 01, 2018, 06:52:42 pm

We have a 2014 Winnebago Sprinter that has been less reliable than we'd like ( both the coach and the chassis ). We are seriously considering selling it and buying a 24' LD.

--Charlie Jordan
middle TN

Charlie, would you share what issues you’ve had with the Sprinter. I think many on this forum have been interested in Sprinters at one time or another. — Jon, currently glued to the World Cup.

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April 14, 2018, 09:52:16 pm

Reply #1 – April 15, 2018, 01:12:19 am

Reply #2 – April 15, 2018, 02:41:09 am

Reply #3 – April 15, 2018, 05:01:51 pm

Reply #4 – April 15, 2018, 06:07:03 pm

Reply #5 – April 15, 2018, 06:38:42 pm

Reply #6 – April 15, 2018, 07:03:26 pm

Reply #7 – April 16, 2018, 10:04:01 am

Reply #8 – April 16, 2018, 11:26:37 am

Reply #9 – April 16, 2018, 12:56:34 pm

Reply #10 – April 17, 2018, 10:40:59 am

Reply #11 – April 17, 2018, 11:34:59 am

Reply #12 – April 17, 2018, 11:37:36 am

Reply #13 – April 17, 2018, 12:18:22 pm

Reply #14 – April 17, 2018, 01:47:57 pm

Reply #15 – April 17, 2018, 08:40:00 pm

Reply #16 – April 20, 2018, 02:01:16 am

Reply #17 – April 20, 2018, 09:51:36 am

Reply #18 – May 28, 2018, 11:16:45 am

Reply #19 – July 01, 2018, 06:52:42 pm

Reply #20 – July 02, 2018, 02:25:51 pm

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