Fully charged then to shade camping and within 24 hours the AGM batteries are at 10.3 to 10.7 volts.
This is a new rig. I don't have a battery monitor yet. I'm on the southern Oregon coast at Bandon.
The refrigerator won't stay lit due to the low voltage. I'm idling the LD right now trying to add juice.
Not a happy camper.
Suggestions?
UPDATE
I ran the coach and got them charged a bit. Hopefully enough for the fridge until the morning.
This is actually the second incidence. The first should have drawn red flags with me. On this trip about a week ago at Panther Flats I noticed the water pump was lagging. We were not plugged in and in the shade as now. I barely got the generator started but did as the volts read in the mid 10's. After an hour and a half of generator they were back up.
I hope it is a bad battery situation rather than some draw going on.
I also hope that maybe Coos Bay has batteries... and that my cost nil as we just purchased this motorhome.
Loose battery cable?
Did you run the heater?
1) You are under warranty. Call the factory or bring in a road technician if LD pays for it. Why beat your brain?
2) If #1 not possible, and you have a multimeter, place it on battery + & -, disconnect input power, solar and generator and see if voltage goes down. Make sure battery terminals are tight per previous comment from Linda B. If voltage goes down over 10-15 minutes something may be draining it or battery is bad. If no drain found call battery manufacturer and describe problem. They may be able to verify bad battery.
Ron
Did you run the heater?
Yes but not a lot.
Loose battery cable?
No. They are tight.
Yes but not a lot.
I'm guessing we need a bit more information. For example, have you been in the same spot (shaded) for a few days using power including the heater (which everyone will tell runs the batteries down quite a bit). If you're not getting a full charge from the solar panel(s) then you're going to need to fire up the generator to get them charged. Of course if you're mobile and heading to a new spot then driving will charge as well. Try to find a spot with that will allow your solar panel(s) to work to their full capacity.
Bill
I'm guessing we need a bit more information. For example, have you been in the same spot (shaded) for a few days using power including the heater (which everyone will tell runs the batteries down quite a bit). If you're not getting a full charge from the solar panel(s) then you're going to need to fire up the generator to get them charged. Of course if you're mobile and heading to a new spot then driving will charge as well. Try to find a spot with that will allow your solar panel(s) to work to their full capacity.
Bill
With my previous LD I didn't have solar. I could use the heater and other items for at least 3 days with my Trojan T-105+ batteries before needing a charge.
I pulled into the shaded campsite fully charged. Within 24 hours the fridge was shutting off. I checked the volts and it was alarmingly 10.5. I took a meter outside across the terminals to confirm and it was 10.5 as shown on my solar controller.
With my previous LD I didn't have solar. I could use the heater and other items for at least 3 days with my Trojan T-105+ batteries before needing a charge.
I pulled into the shaded campsite fully charged. Within 24 hours the fridge was shutting off. I checked the volts and it was alarmingly 10.5. I took a meter outside across the terminals to confirm and it was 10.5 as shown on my solar controller.
Yikes...as mentioned above I'd call both the Mothership and the Battery Customer Service line
Good luck.....what a PIA!!!
Bill
Ted, my *uneducated* guess is that your batteries are bad. Your rig may be new, but I think this was the factory demo, wasn't it? Who knows how often those batteries were depleted or left in an extended state of discharge? The folks at LD should give you a new pair of batteries if they delivered it with batteries that were marginal at best.
Steve K
Ted, my *uneducated* guess is that your batteries are bad. Your rig may be new, but I think this was the factory demo, wasn't it? Who knows how often those batteries were depleted or left in an extended state of discharge? The folks at LD should give you a new pair of batteries if they delivered it with batteries that were marginal at best.
Steve K
Oh, if that's the case then that seems to be the culprit...
Hi Ted; Your batteries may be almost ok. Through experience with my wet lead acid batteries, they stratify and develop a surface sulphate barrier layer due to being fully charged and just sitting there. I'd go to Morro Bay, and watch the battery voltage drop through use. Minimal charge throughout the day. At night I would use the heater. My old TK has a small fan, about 3 amps to run it, about 1 1/2 incandescent light fixtures worth, and (not on continually). [how do you heat a bigger motorhome with the same size space to put the heater? Bigger burner and bigger fan!] I would watch the voltage and during the night the resting voltage would increase! After a few days of this the batteries would break through the sulphate layer and start working as designed, with not as much voltage droop, and better peak current response, water pump speed with lights on, etc.
Your converter and solar both can do equalization, which is designed to destratify the electrolyte, and prevent sulphation, but the AGM batteries would be damaged. I think that letting them 'droop', then charging with the engine alternator will help restore them. The engine alternator is more 'brute force'. Just a 3 phase sine wave with full wave rectification, the pulsating DC will be good for the somnolent batteries.
A side note: I had an Interstate starting battery that should have lasted longer, in the trunk of my car as I went to Costco to have a tire sender replaced (12 years old), and they couldn't start the car. Called AAA and they determined the Interstate battery was bad, less than a year old, bought at Costco. They replaced that one, no charge, and the one in the trunk for a minimal fee. The store person said that they had a lot of batteries failing lately. I researched Interstate, and they market and advertise, but have contracts with other makers Exide, Johnson and others. So they don't actually make batteries.
Like Larry I'm waiting to see what shakes out in the LiFePO4 arena. RonB
I agree if the unit was a demo batteries seem to be bad. Also, if you have two batteries one may be bad. One may be good.
Here is a statement from Trojan users manual:
* If any recorded voltage differs from another one by more than 0.3V, compared to any
other battery in the set, you may have a failed battery.
So you would have to isolate both batteries from everything by disconnecting the cables. If batteries are charged then measure the voltage after every say 15 minutes. See if one or both batteries voltage differs by 0.3V between readings. If you find one is bad you can just connect the good one (if they are 12 volt!) and have use of things until you can get them replaced.
Link to manual.
https://www.trojanbattery.com/pdf/TrojanBattery_UsersGuide.pdf
Ron
Snap a picture of cables BEFORE disconnecting them. Makes it easier later.
I believe Ted's factory batteries are Lifeline AGM, not Trojan.
America's Best Deep Cycle RV Battery| Lifeline Batteries (https://lifelinebatteries.com/products/rv-batteries/)
With my previous LD I didn't have solar. I could use the heater and other items for at least 3 days with my Trojan T-105+ batteries before needing a charge.
I pulled into the shaded campsite fully charged. Within 24 hours the fridge was shutting off. I checked the volts and it was alarmingly 10.5. I took a meter outside across the terminals to confirm and it was 10.5 as shown on my solar controller.
Ted, as your no rookie here, your old MH was much like ours. My thought comes to, do you have some kind of inverter that might be drawing the battery's down in the new motor home that you didn't have in the old one. Or pull the center positive to negative lead off the battery and read your voltage on each battery and see if they each read 6 volts when charged. The one that doesn't read 6v may have a dead cell.
Jon
If you find one is bad you can just connect the good one (if they are 12 volt!) and have use of things until you can get them replaced.
The batteries are 6 volt wired in series.
Charles
Had the same problem... batteries not holding charge.
Turned out to be loose connection at chassis ground on the frame. Once it was tightened, no more problem! ::)
UPDATE
Lifeline is sending 2 new batteries to a Coos Bay battery place where I'll have them installed.
Good customer service.
Ted, as your no rookie here, your old MH was much like ours. My thought comes to, do you have some kind of inverter that might be drawing the battery's down in the new motor home that you didn't have in the old one. Or pull the center positive to negative lead off the battery and read your voltage on each battery and see if they each read 6 volts when charged. The one that doesn't read 6v may have a dead cell.
Jon
No inverter. All stock.
Had the same problem... batteries not holding charge.
Turned out to be loose connection at chassis ground on the frame. Once it was tightened, no more problem! ::)
The chassis battery ground on the MB is located where? I'd like to check it.
Anyone know?
I'll crawl around and take a look.
Thanks
Hi Ted,
The chassis ground on our RB was near the battery box. Followed the conduit to the frame.
Kent
The chassis battery ground on the MB is located where? I'd like to check it.
We recently had a thread on this, Ted:
Chassis Ground (https://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=36609.msg232137#msg232137)
We recently had a thread on this, Ted:
Chassis Ground (https://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=36609.msg232137#msg232137)
Thanks.
Found it.
It's tight.
Without doing a lot of checking, tightening and testing, while using a multimeter, you can't know for sure if the batteries are bad, new ones may not cure the situation. Since the AGMs are being replaced under warranty, that's great but you may find the problem still exists.
I do agree that if this was an LD floor model, the batteries could have been fried while at the Mothership, AGMs are very sensitive creatures and are not a robust as the older Trojan lead-acid batteries.
In the meantime, I would check and tighten every accessable connection, check the circuit breakers, including the "hidden" breaker, now I believe it's located in the battery compartment on the back wall.
Once you have installed a battery monitor, you will be able to watch the charging and discharging currents to get a better idea of what is occuring in the charging system andif there are loads you are not aware of. They are handy devices.
Larry
....
I do agree that if this was an LD floor model, the batteries could have been fried while at the Mothership, AGMs are very sensitive creatures and are not a robust as the older Trojan lead-acid batteries.
....
Larry
I'm going to assume a few things.
This is a demo showroom model built in January 2020.
The covid shutdown closed the showroom.
If this coach wasn't plugged in or in direct sun then these AGM's might be toast. We'll know soon. I'm getting knew ones installed next week and I'll have the old ones tested.
I've checked the connections and circuit breakers. All good.
This is a demo showroom model built in January 2020.
The covid shutdown closed the showroom.
If this coach wasn't plugged in or in direct sun then these AGM's might be toast. We'll know soon. I'm getting knew ones installed next week and I'll have the old ones tested.
I've checked the connections and circuit breakers. All good.
You have done what you can do, the new batteries will provide the answer. Glad that they can be replaced under warranty without returning to LD. Good chance the floor model experience, and being shut down for a long period damaged the batteries.
Good luck and enjoy your new rig.
Larry
You have done what you can do, the new batteries will provide the answer. Glad that they can be replaced under warranty without returning to LD. Good chance the floor model experience, and being shut down for a long period damaged the batteries.
Good luck and enjoy your new rig.
Larry
It's been a good rig so far.
I'm really liking the 7.3 liter power and the 6 speed transmission.
It's been a good rig so far.
I'm really liking the 7.3 liter power and the 6 speed transmission.
stop teasing us!!!!!! LOL
Ted, is LD or Lifeline footing the bill?
Ted, is LD or Lifeline footing the bill?
Yes. Covered by Lifeline.
I don't want to install them but the battery place said they would install them for under $50 so I'm good with that.
stop teasing us!!!!!! LOL
😂🤣
Yaahh. I purchased lifeline AGMs and was very impressed with technical support and the battery itself. They are heavy so it is great they can install them for you. Like all installs done by someone else make sure they do it right. Don’t cross the positive and negative cables, if possible, as wear between touching cables can give undesired results.
Hope your troubles are now behind you. Enjoy your LD!! Glad to hear the new engine is grand!
Ron
Frankly I'm surprised you can run the refrigerator off electric when shaded. On our 2000 MB, the fridge puts quite a draw on the batteries. We always run the fridge off propane, unless filling for gas, etc. Is this common on the newer rigs, to be able to run fridges off electrical while parked?
"I'm surprised you can run the refrigerator off electric when shaded."
I believe what Ted meant was that the DC voltage was dropping so low that the fridge would not work on propane--that is, its controller board couldn't get enough 12 V juice. As far as I know, Lazy Dazes have never been factory equipped to run the fridge from batteries, since the 30+ amp draw would quickly drain them.
"I'm surprised you can run the refrigerator off electric when shaded."
I believe what Ted meant was that the DC voltage was dropping so low that the fridge would not work on propane--that is, its controller board couldn't get enough 12 V juice. As far as I know, Lazy Dazes have never been factory equipped to run the fridge from batteries, since the 30+ amp draw would quickly drain them.
Correct. On propane. The control board wasn't able to operate at 10.6VDC understandably.
Just an FYI...My 95TK was 3 way power sourced.
I never used the 12VDC much because of the drain.
LPG
Shore.
12VDC.
All good now with these new replacement batteries it seems. I'm loving how the solar keeps them topped off.
Just an FYI...My 95TK was 3 way power sourced.
I never used the 12VDC much because of the drain.
Our old 1983 LD’s refrigerator drew 23-24 amps, when operated on 12-volts. It was only operated on 12-volts when we were driving.
Larry
"I'm surprised you can run the refrigerator off electric when shaded."
I believe what Ted meant was that the DC voltage was dropping so low that the fridge would not work on propane--that is, its controller board couldn't get enough 12 V juice. As far as I know, Lazy Dazes have never been factory equipped to run the fridge from batteries, since the 30+ amp draw would quickly drain them.
Thanks Andy, that makes sense. We're happy to have had AM Solar wire up our inverter so we can switch to electric when needed (e.g., at gas stations, when filling propane), or even while driving if we want, but yeah, that's quite a draw!
And it may just be my perception, but I'd say the fridge stays colder on propane than on AC. That surprised me too.