Hi. I had the audio system replaced in my 2005 26.5 LD. I forgot to check everything before I left the installer. The new audio system sounds great but now there is no 12 volt power to the rest of the house. I didn't notice it until our next trip, so it's been a few weeks. I'm ready to go back to the installer, but he doubts that anything he did would cause this problem. The batteries are perfect and only the audio system has power. No blow fuses. Am I missing something, or could he have done something wrong during the install?
Does your coach battery have a switch?
It would be located between the two coach batteries and may have been turned off as a safety precaution.
Larry
Hi. I had the audio system replaced in my 2005 26.5 LD. I forgot to check everything before I left the installer. The new audio system sounds great but now there is no 12 volt power to the rest of the house. I didn't notice it until our next trip, so it's been a few weeks. I'm ready to go back to the installer, but he doubts that anything he did would cause this problem. The batteries are perfect and only the audio system has power. No blow fuses. Am I missing something, or could he have done something wrong during the install?
What model/floor plan do you have? I'd like to add it to your profile.
Chris
This is a long shot, but...
If you have a midbath, remove the drawer below the fridge, reach around the left side of the opening and feel/look for a small black or gray box (about 1" x 1/2" x 1/2", as I recall) with a small black button on one side. This is your master 12 V circuit breaker. Push the button to reset it. If you're lucky, that may cure the problem.
By the way, the audio system Lazy Daze installs at the factory is wired so that it gets its power from the house batteries, rather than from the engine's starting battery. That's so you can listen to it while parked, without fear of running down your starting battery.
If your new stereo has power but your house 12 V system doesn't, then it sounds as if your installer changed the power source, and your new stereo is powered by the starting battery. That's not a great way to do things, for the reason just mentioned.
It seems likely that in the process of changing over the power source for the new stereo, the installer somehow tripped that master breaker. That's my guess, anyhow. If you can solve your house 12 V problem by resetting the breaker, fine--but I would insist on having the wiring corrected so that the new unit is powered by the house batteries, as the factory intended. Otherwise someday you might find yourself unable to fire up that V10, because the stereo drained your starting battery.
If you have a midbath, remove the drawer below the fridge, reach around the left side of the opening and feel/look for a small black or gray box (about 1" x 1/2" x 1/2", as I recall) with a small black button on one side. This is your master 12 V circuit breaker. Push the button to reset it. If you're lucky, that may cure the problem.
If this or the battery switch is not the cause of the problem, a voltmeter or a 12-volt test light can be used to trace the 12-volt power between the coach battery and Power Center, located inside the rig, at floor level, find the spot where the power stops.
This is a good opportunity to find the location of the 'hidden' circuit breaker, every LD owner should know this.
FYI, some of the circuit breakers have a reset button, others are automatic and reset after a certain amount of time. If the short is not corrected, an automatic breaker will eventually burn out and require replacement.
Larry
Wow. Thanks for all the responses. I've checked them all. I'm still looking for this mysterious hidden switch under the fridge. I don't see it anywhere. Could this be the switch located at the back of the battery compartment? Mine is a 2005 26.5 mid-bath Island bed.
The only clue the Factory gives is that the 'hidden' breaker is within 2' of the Power Center, a RIVA code requirement.
Use Andy's instructions on its location, find the wires coming from the battery box (you can see the back of the black plastic battery box from the cabinet under the refrigerator) to the Power Center, the breaker will be near the bundle of wires going off to the left.
It's in there, keep looking.
Larry
Mine is a 2005 26.5 mid-bath Island bed.
Do you have a permanent queen bed in the rear, instead of two couches that can be pulled together? If so, you have one of the uncommon 26.5' Island Bed model. I don't know how much they have in common with what we all call the Mid-Bath model.
Art
Wow. Thanks for all the responses. I've checked them all. I'm still looking for this mysterious hidden switch under the fridge. I don't see it anywhere. Could this be the switch located at the back of the battery compartment? Mine is a 2005 26.5 mid-bath Island bed.
We are confused by your description of the floorplan, If it is 26.5' Queen Bed, it's a very rare floorplan that was discontinued many years ago, I have no idea where it would be.
I would find the battery box and Power Center and check the wire run between the two of them, that is where the breaker will be located. You may need to remove a panel or reach up inside a cabinet to find it.
Maybe an owner of the same floorplan will tell us.
Larry
Ours is a much older coach and a mid bath our battery's are located just ahead of the entrance door. The hidden breaker is mounted under the dinette seat in a position where you need to stand on your head to see it. It is in fact within 2 feet of the battery's. They are really hard to see, so keep looking.
Jon
Um, while we’re on the subject, can someone point out where this breaker is located in a TK circa 2006? — Jon
Um, while we’re on the subject, can someone point out where this breaker is located in a TK circa 2006? — Jon
Ask Joan.
The battery box and Power Center are not far apart, expect to find the breaker inside a cabinet or behind a drawer, between them.
Larry
Hi Jon. I have a TK, vintage '99. IIRC I saw it when I was putting in some wiring mods about 18 years ago. Check to see if there are those little brass flat head screws holding down the panel that forms the base of the vanity cabinet. Right where the cabinet angles toward the power center in the 'closest to you' area between the battery box back, and the angled area is a breaker. It looked like a self resetting breaker, but it might have had a button to reset it. I'll check it and take a picture, if I remember, tomorrow. RonB
I have read and reread Mbrown's post and all the replies several times. Some questions I would ask Mbrown (the original poster) is HOW do you know your batteries are "perfect"? Have you checked each one individually with a voltmeter to see if each 6 volt battery is making 6+ volts? Or have you checked the volts of the 2 batteries to make sure you are getting 12+volts?
My thought is that the installer disconnected the house batteries when they removed the old audio system because it was connected to the house batteries. It seems they wired the new audio system into the truck battery since it is working. It may be that they did not reconnect the house batteries properly. If the cable that connects the positive terminal of one battery to the negative terminal of the other battery, is not connected properly, the "perfect" batteries will not put out the 12 volts you need.
I know this well since we had a cable terminal break off a cable while we were parked in a rest area. We have the battery disconnect switch and one of the cables to the switch broke and was no longer connected. I thought for sure a battery had failed. I checked each battery and was getting over 6 volts but when I checked the combination of the 2 batteries I had no volts showing. I stopped at an auto parts store and bought a short new cable to connect the two batteries together and I then had power. I was ready to start looking for hidden circuit breakers and tripped breakers. This is sort of like appliance manuals that say to check to see if it is plugged in before calling a repair person.
Please let us know how this problem is solved.
Steve K.
"My thought is that the installer disconnected the house batteries when they removed the old audio system because it was connected to the house batteries. It seems they wired the new audio system into the truck battery since it is working. It may be that they did not reconnect the house batteries properly."
Exactly. The installer, treating the RV as if it were a car, hooked up the new stereo to the engine's start battery instead to the house batteries, the way the original unit was connected. (You'd think they would have noticed that when they disconnected the old unit. Or maybe they just thought, "Wow, that's screwy. I'll do it the right way this time.") In the process, they somehow screwed up the house 12 V system--probably by tripping a DC breaker.
MBrown1, you'll need to find the tripped breaker... and if it were me, I'd have that installer rewire the new stereo so that it's powered by the house batteries, the way it's supposed to be.
Hi Andy, yes I can see the installer disconnecting the chassis battery to work on the new radio, then shorting out the house battery fuse, thinking that it wasn't 'live'. I think the radio fuse is under the hood near the isolator and the CB fuse in those yellow fuse holders. Then when they turned the new radio on, couldn't get the radio to work, so hooked it up to the chassis battery. RonB
Good guess, Ron. This installer was not too bright.
Thank you everyone. I'm caught off guard by the number of responses. Yes 2006 is the last year the island bed was offered on the 26.5 . we were very happy to find it. I went back to the installer. He kept it for two days and swears the audio is correctly wired to the house batteries and checked them too. fully charged. i still haven't found the breaker. the way you've described it must be on the same side as the battery box and power center and not on the side with the refer. I'll check tomorrow and give an update. my only option looks like hiring a $$ rv pro. thanks again Matt
"He kept it for two days and swears the audio is correctly wired to the house batteries..."
Interesting. In your original post you said "The new audio system sounds great but now there is no 12 volt power to the rest of the house." If that's correct, it's hard to imagine how the stereo could be wired to the house batteries.
"i still haven't found the breaker. the way you've described it must be on the same side as the battery box and power center"
It's going to be close to the batteries, that's for sure--probably less than two feet away. It'll look like this: smaller than an ice cube, probably with a small round reset button on one side.
Thank you Andy. I will be back on the hunt tonight!
Matt,
In my 2003 TK it's located between the power center and the fridge. When the drawer below the fridge is removed I can look to the left and see the battery box. The fuse is located close to the top corner of the battery box mounted on the interior cabinet framework.
Steve
Thanks Steve, I knew I had seen it somewhere, but I must have had the drawer out. That was a long time ago. Hopefully that will help Matt out. RonB
Hey Matt,
I wasn't sure whether you were able to resolve your power issue but since I too have a 26.5 Island Bed(2004) our floor plans are more than likely identical and just thought I would share some info. This is a pic of an electric assembly that is on the back wall of the coach battery compartment that was identified by another member of the forum as a 50amp main circuit breaker. Maybe this is the elusive breaker that you seek? Best regards from one Matt to another:)
Hi. Kinda crazy. My name is Matt Brown and I was just in Yachats OR last week. Nice weather. This is it! This must be the breaker all are speaking of. I can only see a switch on the left side in your picture. When I hold it in, it doesn't reset, hold in place or really do anything at all. Any thoughts? Replacement?
Hi. Kinda crazy. My name is Matt Brown and I was just in Yachats OR last week. Nice weather. This is it! This must be the breaker all are speaking of. I can only see a switch on the left side in your picture. When I hold it in, it doesn't reset, hold in place or really do anything at all. Any thoughts? Replacement?
Nope, that's the main 12-volt circuit breaker. The 'hidden' breaker is inside the coach, two feet or less away from the battery box, in between the battery box and the Power Center.
The main breaker cannot be used as a switch, the lever only moves when it blows.
Larry
Just out of curiosity, does anybody know why there are two "main" 12V breakers? There must be a difference in function, but I've never understood what it was. I've never known the outside breaker to trip, but I have seen the smaller inside breaker trip a few times, so that must be a clue.
I under stood it to protect the wiring either to the truck alternator or to the converter.
Jon
Just out of curiosity, does any body know why there are two "main" 12V breakers? There must be a difference in function, but I've never understood what it was. I've never known the outside breaker to trip, but I have seen the smaller inside breaker trip a few times, so that must be a clue.
I think it is a code requirement to have one real close to the batteries. The other one is for convenience.
That's a bummer! The only other place I can think to look is in the under counter cabinet behind where your power center is located. If the switch, as Larry says, is between the batteries and the power center, then the switch must be in the small space between the back wall of the battery compartment and the power center which is just on the other side of that back wall in the 26.5 IB layout. Unfortunately, to see that area you will need to slide the power center out to expose the area behind it. The instructions for how to remove the power center are in your factory Lazy Daze instruction manual in the section on how to replace the water pump(it is also located behind the power center). Once you remove the screws that secure the unit to the mounting frame it is a pretty firm pull forward due to the heavy gauge wires attached to the back. Get a firm grip. Also, just like Larry mentioned, there is only the minimum of extra wire slack to work with so be careful to support the unit at the same height as the opening when fully removed so the connections and terminals are not stressed. There is not enough slack to lay the unit on the floor. I truly hope this elusive holy grail you seek is is back there Matt!
Just out of curiosity, does any body know why there are two "main" 12V breakers? There must be a difference in function, but I've never understood what it was. I've never known the outside breaker to trip, but I have seen the smaller inside breaker trip a few times, so that must be a clue.
The 12-volt, 100-amp breaker is connected to the isolator or relay, in the engine compartment, the other side connected to the positive terminal on the coach battery.
It's there to protect the battery in case the isolator wire is shorted.
All 12-volt battery power to the interior of the coach is routed through the hidden circuit breaker.
RIVA requires all wires connect to the battery's positive to be fused within 2' of the positive terminal.
Larry
It looks to me like there is an in-line breaker inside the battery compartment next to the main breaker. You've probably checked that as well, but just thought I'd mention it.
David G.
To all. Larry nailed it. the hidden relay behind the breaker panel had tripped. Probably caused when the radio was installed or when i was messing with the batteries Thanks again to everyone for your guidance.
Glad you found it! I'm still a little unclear. Was the breaker that you are referring to located in the back of the outside battery compartment or in the space inside the coach that is behind the power control center with the breaker panel? The water pump is also located in that space. Thanks!
I assume we are talking about the coach batteries, not the starter battery. Where would this "hidden" circuit breaker be on a 30IB?
Hi Matt Brown (1); Glad you found it finally. It is a resettable circuit breaker, NOT a relay. That still leaves you the problem, caused by your installer. Obviously your new stereo is running off of your chassis battery. The next time you are enjoying your 'tunes' for an extended time, you may not be able to start your engine to 'get out of Dodge'. I'll point out here that your chassis battery likely isn't a deep cycle battery, and deep discharging it will ruin it in quick order. I've found that car batteries are good for about two or three dumps like that before they become unreliable as starter batteries. Good chassis batteries are actually more expensive than deep cycle house batteries. RonB
To all. Larry nailed it. the hidden relay behind the breaker panel had tripped. Probably caused when the radio was installed or when i was messing with the batteries Thanks again to everyone for your guidance.
Still a mystery to me, also, Matt. Just exactly where is this "hidden" relay or breaker. If it's hidden behind the breaker panel, how did you find it? Can you post a photo of it.
Chris
That still leaves you the problem, caused by your installer. Obviously your new stereo is running off of your chassis battery.
Not necessarily, the installer may have connected directly to the coach batteries or the coach side of the battery isolator under the hood. The breaker that caused this problem is between the coach batteries and the LD house fuse/distribution panel. The OP should remove the ground cable from his chassis battery and see if the radio still works.
Art
Good point Art. Certainly a large enough wire, and easy to get to. Power goes through the 100 Amp resettable breaker in the battery box, but not through the 50 Amp resettable breaker going from battery to fuse panel. That explains why the radio worked, but the 'house' didn't. Batttery charger portion of converter not connected of course, but the engine would charge the batteries. RonB