Hello all. ;
After a year of planning, reading the forum, and attending the NE fall rally last year, the time to order our new LD has come. We received our packet Friday and we are making our choices on options for a new mid-bath. We are hoping for a delivery in March or April next year. After reading all of the posts re: options, I think we know what we want. Please feel free to give us some final advice before we send in our order.
Options we are planning on:
-Battery disconnect
-second solar panel ( we will boondock some but not much)
-hardwood dashboard
-back up camera
-power mirrors
-as many extra power outlets as Todd will let us have
The one thing we would like advice the most on is the interior fabric. We are leaning towards the Ultra leather. For those of you that have the leather, do you like it and does it wear well?
Thanks again for all the advice on the forum, and to the NE group for letting us visit.
Goggle Ultra Leather failures. There have been some reports of premature failure on Ultra Leather products recently. They report flaking and chipping of the fabric. Most recently Phoenix Cruiser and one other boutique rv builder stopped using and gone to leather.
We have a fake leather product in our boat. Looks real nice but bedding does not adhere very well to so a lot of slipping and sliding pulling sheets out after tucked in. Also a little cooler to the touch, which is good in the summer, but colder in off seasons. IMHO :P
"Options we are planning on:
-Battery disconnect
-second solar panel ( we will boondock some but not much)
-hardwood dashboard
-back up camera
-power mirrors
-as many extra power outlets as Todd will let us have."
I would order the battery disconnect again --- it's handy for isolating the system and trouble shooting.
2nd Solar Panel --- Given how LD places the panels I wish I had waited to have an aftermarket supplier do the work. Currently I have three 100w panels installed by AM Solar in Springfield (Eugene) OR. I could have saved some hassle and dollars had I waited!
Hardwood (plastic) dashboard overlay --- Nice to look at but not necessarily necessary!
Backup Camera --- Absolutely essential, particularly for a novice and extremely helpful for the average driver!
Power Mirrors --- Ehc., kind of a personal choice. If you need to change drivers frequently or need to adjust in a driving rain storm they could be handy. For the dollars spent I can adjust my own, although I'll give you the fact that it's a PITA the few times it's necessary.
Power Outlets --- Oh my yes, load to the limit!
Interior Fabric --- A total personal choice... go for the one that will not show the dirt! ;)
"Given how LD places the panels I wish I had waited to have an aftermarket supplier do the work. Currently I have three 100w panels installed by AM Solar in Springfield (Eugene) OR. I could have saved some hassle and dollars had I waited!"
----
I don't think that the factory will agree not to install one 100W panel, but I'd leave the installation of additional panels placed most efficiently and any upgrades or changes done to a skilled solar installer like AM Solar or Quality RV Solar or another equally qualified. Having one panel installed gets the wiring run; beyond that, I don't see an advantage (except "convenience") to having the factory do any more.
"Ultraleather" is polyurethane; some like it, some don't. (So do some cats; I suggest a careful evaluation of this product if one travels with a cat.)
Hi John and Steph; These are all just my opinions, (but they are free). I like leather in my cars, but not in my motorhome. I find the fabric far superior in comfort, and cleanability. A rip in the fabric can be sewn up, repairing the polyurethane, not so easy. As Joan said, I travel with three cats. Someone here mentioned that the fabric presently available isn't as high a quality as the older stuff. I don't know where my fabric falls in that comment.
You can't have too much solar, but get the two panels and you should be good to go. If you later decide you need more; you can add it then. Maybe you won't need more. To really use more you would want to add more batteries also. So that can wait until you feel you really need it.
Power mirrors might not be needed, but can't hurt. If you both drive and need the mirrors in different locations, it is great. Adjusting the manual passenger side can be a pain.
Backup camera. The first time you don't hit something backing up, will pay for the camera. I didn't like the price 20 years ago, but having a camera makes it easier, even if it is just to see what is going on back there. I have hit things either too high, or too low to see in the camera. (minor things, not too much damage, I won't talk about it!) Worth every cent. Whether you have Lazy Daze do it, or do it your self. Hard wired is the best.
Hardwood dash is a taste thing. I don't look at the dash much, and if I did the standard dash is fine. Better to spend money elsewhere, but it's your call. The battery disconnect is a waste of money to me. I store it in my driveway and the solar keeps my batteries (all three) charged up. I don't like the quality of the switch LD supplies. If I did want a disconnect I would install my own choice of a better switch. If I'm working on the electrical (12vdc especially) I do it live, but that's me.
One thing for sure, I would order the back wall bracing and fold up table a'la the Twin King 24' back table. While you may be thinking 'I'm just going to sleep back there', in practice I think the forward dinette is a bit small and cramped, and people gravitate to the back where the wrap around windows, and view are. Visitors particularly fit better in the back, and that table is really handy. The table folds up easily when the couches are pulled out for sleeping. If you sleep in the cabover, the rear table makes the rear area even more usable. The more outlets the better. Not that you would use all of them at once, but that as your needs change, you have more versatile placements. I would have a 12vdc and 110vAC on each side of the fold down back table on the back wall.
Enjoy the wait. I'm curious what color you are contemplating, outside and inside? RonB
We are hoping for a delivery in March or April next year
Is that the mothership guestimate or have you padded it for a more realistic delivery timeframe?
;)
Joel
My opinion on solar power: unless you plan to stay in full-hookup campgrounds exclusively, you'll want more than one 100W panel. That said, I agree with Steve and Joan in saying that the LD factory places panels poorly (e.g., where they will be shaded by the air conditioner), charges way too much for a second panel, and won't go beyond two. Unless you can talk them out of the standard single panel, accept that--but go to AM Solar or one of their certified installers and have more added.
About Ultraleather (textured, fabric-backed polyurethane)--I have it in my Airstream, and it has its pluses and minuses. It feels very soft and supple, and doesn't stick to you as much as vinyl. Spills wipe off. It is a bit slippery, and at first I found myself slowly slouching down under the dinette table, but I soon got used to it and stopped doing that. It can be damaged by a cat (I travel with one), but so can any upholstery covering. The main difference is that because Ultraleather is a solid color, any physical damage will be more obvious than it would be with a patterned fabric.
Overall, I like it.
We put a 120 outlet by tv to hookup our Dish Receiver and hard drive when connected to shore power. We also had them run another line to hookup our Dish tailgator externally for a backup to satellite (when under trees, etc.)
-second solar panel ( we will boondock some but not much)
If you're not going to do much boondocking, then one solar panel will be plenty.
I'm with the others who say that, if you decide you like boondocking and want to add more solar panels in the future, have a solar installer, like AM Solar, do the work.
Hello all. ;
After a year of planning, reading the forum, and attending the NE fall rally last year, the time to order our new LD has come. We received our packet Friday and we are making our choices on options for a new mid-bath. We are hoping for a delivery in March or April next year. After reading all of the posts re: options, I think we know what we want. Please feel free to give us some final advice before we send in our order.
Options we are planning on:
-Battery disconnect
-second solar panel ( we will boondock some but not much)
-hardwood dashboard
-back up camera
-power mirrors
-as many extra power outlets as Todd will let us have
The one thing we would like advice the most on is the interior fabric. We are leaning towards the Ultra leather. For those of you that have the leather, do you like it and does it wear well?
Thanks again for all the advice on the forum, and to the NE group for letting us visit.
Restating what others have said, the interior fabric is a personal choice. Definitely consider what effect any pets you may travel with would have on your chosen material. DW and I have always preferred cloth over leather or leather-like materials in our vehicles and home interiors.
I agree with all your other options listed with the exception of the fake hardwood dash (once again, a personal choice). I'm still vacillating over having the factory install a second solar panel. I would probably go with the one to see if there is a need, then have an aftermarket company do the install, if need be.
Good luck on your decision and upcoming adventures!
Options we are planning on
-Battery disconnect
-second solar panel ( we will boondock some but not much)
-hardwood dashboard
-back up camera
-power mirrors
-as many extra power outlets as Todd will let us have
<smile> hmmm like coffee, tires, and black tank cleaning you will have no end to the opinions from this august company. Having said that let me add a few of my own......
1. Battery Discount -- yes. There are times you will need to remove the batteries from the system to troubleshoot this and that.
It's a bit easier then disconnecting the batteries themselves. The main problem is room. LD doesn't make a very large companment for the AGM's. So when working in that space is a bit of a problem. I have learned to insulate my tools. Watching you tools short out the battery is also a fun thing.
2. Second Solar -- depends.
We have two factory install panels. And I built one to teach/learn solar with a hands on task.
A. Be honest with yourself about electric use. For instance we use solar rechargeable lights and head lamps, no TV or computer use, have e-book readers or tree based readers so our power usage in very low.
B. At my last look LD was charging I think $400 for the extra panel. If you are handy you could install at least two more 200 watt panels with wiring and hardware for a lot less than that price.
3. hardwood dashboard -- yes. Love the look. Yes its fake but the beast is a medium duty truck its nice to spruce it up a bit.
4. back up camera -- If I may -- YES. Things like concert post, trees, and house do love to dash behind your LD. Your only protection is keeping any eye on them. Trust me they a very very sneaky.
5. Power Mirrors -- Yup. They are also heated. Being able to adjust thing from the comfort of your seat is worth every penny.
6. Power outlets -- yes. Let the factory wire them in. Even if you never use them or all of them you will have then available for future use. It is much easier for them to do the wiring then you.
7. Fabric -- we travel with two cats or should I say the cats take us for the ride. We have the fake leather seats up front. They are covered with sheepskins for out personal comfort. One cat loves to claw stuff so we have cat tape on just about all surfaces. We brought from the factory a yard or two of the identical fabric to throw down on various surfaces so he can claw at his heart's content without us yelling at him.
glen
Glen, the second panel is up to $850:
Lazy Daze 2019 Options Price List (https://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=33295.0)
Glen, the second panel is up to $850:
Lazy Daze 2019 Options Price List (https://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=33295.0)
Gwad ..... with that in mind
Buy one and built out on your own dime. Cheaper and more fun. It truly is very easy. If I can do it anybody can.
glen
Re: Solar - 2 is cheaper than 5.
Here is my experience, and as the refrain goes, YMMV.
I debated 1 vs 2 when ordering in 2013 and ultimately went with 1. It did not seem much of an issue until I went to Quartzite last year. Prior to that I hadn't done much boondocking. Reflecting, had I gotten 2 panels originally, I probably would not have added 3 more this year. That is not to say I would never have added if I had started with 2.
I am quite happy with the 2 180 & 2 100 W panels installed. Weight & space considerations preclude adding 2 more AGMs on my 31IB.
Again, YMMV
Joel
"the second panel is up to $850"
That's just nuts. OK, installing the first panel, wiring, and solar controller costs the factory something, but that's built into the purchase price. But adding a second 100 W panel at build time can't possibly cost them more than a hundred fifty bucks, even including labor and overhead. Charging eight hundred fifty dollars for that option is ridiculous. (And as mentioned, they mount the panels in inefficient places.)
I'm not saying AM Solar will add a second panel for a hundred fifty bucks. Retrofitting always costs more than building in. But I can't imagine them charging $850 to add one more panel. (Anybody who's had it done want to put a number on this?)
Glen, the second panel is up to $850:
Lazy Daze 2019 Options Price List (https://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=33295.0)
One issue with getting one or two panels, with the intentions of adding more panels . To efficiency used the added future power, the lead-in cables (wires) will need to be up-sized, either with all new cable or adding a second set of cables, in parallel with the originals..
Undersize wire or cables can severely decrease the usable solar output.
One possible solutions to living with the small cable is to wire the panels in series, this works in many cases but it isn't often recommended because of the shadowing problem, shading one panel will greatly reduce the output. Parallel wiring of panels is normally used since shading one panel will not reduce the output of the other panels.
Many floorpans allow getting to and removing the Factory solar cables, enabling up sizing without cosmetic damage.
The solar controller may need to be changed to a unit that can handle higher amperage, depending on the maximum solar output.
Larry
Power Mirrors --- I do almost all the driving but I am constantly finding use for the power mirrors. When I’m pulling up to a dump station I position the mirror so I can see the valve. This makes pulling up to the correct spot easy as I can see the valve and the concrete typically around the dump. When backing into a spot, I put the mirror on any large items that may do damage the sides of the RV (works for large ground objects best but also works for tree limbs). We have a single car drive way. The mirror allows me to put the rear tire right at the edge of the driveway so we can walk down the opposite side. The area here has a number of triangles that made it easier in the 50s to merge with traffic. I can move the mirror to see oncoming traffic that would otherwise might be hidden.
We picked up our 2018 rig in March. We love the 2nd solar panel, the back up camera is essential for us. We travel with a toad and I keep the camera on while I drive. We have a battery disconnect switch though we have not used it. I’m not sure we would order it again. We have the ultra leather throughput. Love it on the chairs, but it makes the couch very slick. I did not order the power mirrors and am satisfied with that choice. We thought about the dash trim package but frankly I prefer the black panel. We did have a satellite cable added which is really nice if you plan to have a dish some day.
Randy
The solar controller may need to be changed to a unit that can handle higher amperage, depending on the maximum solar output.
Larry
Larry - in corresponding with AM Solar, they are saying that they could add one more panel (I have two now from the factory) without having to change the Controller....going above 3 panels, I would need to change it out...fyi...
Backup Camera --- Absolutely essential, particularly for a novice and extremely helpful for the average driver!
Agree, but caveat - you can't see everything behind you, which may cause a reduction in caution.
This is why I backed our rig into a tree trunk - it was growing at an angle, so extended past the curb high enough to be out of view of the camera. I have a slight bend in the roof ladder to remind me to carefully check mirrors, and if not certain, GET OUT and check!
Steve
The use of a good back up camera is very handy, however, it does little good for low lying obstructions such as camp ground boundary markers. These are most often heavy immovable objects such as concrete logs or large boulders.
The camera is generally helpful to get the rig into the slot but very soon it is advisable to get out and look.
Recently, while filling up with propane at my local U-Haul, I GOAL’ed several times to avoid a pesky trailer hitch. The camera showed it was there but a closer look kept me safe. 🧐
Kent
Thanks to everyone for all the helpful advice. We are completing the order form now and mailing it out tomorrow. So excited, and can't wait til next spring!
We are going with silver exterior; one solar panel; ultra leather and cherry interior; back up camera; power mirrors; hardwood dash; and battery disconnect switch.
We will stayed tuned in to the forums for more advice and info.
Thanks again!
"...and cherry interior."
One word of caution... Appearance.
I had considered the cherry interior but when I was able to see the difference between that and the lighter offering (Oak ?) it was immediately apparent that the 'cherry' made the interior appear much darker and gloomy. I'm glad I changed my mind! :o ;)
"it was immediately apparent that the 'cherry' made the interior appear much darker and gloomy."
Agreed. I love cherry as a wood, but the LD's windows are already heavily tinted, making the interior darker than that of many RVs. Add a dark wood like cherry and you can end up with a gloomy interior.
Of course this is a matter of personal taste, but I'd suggest thinking hard about how dark you want your rig to be inside before choosing cherry.
I agree that the interior color choice is a matter of personal taste, but I also find the the “cherry” interior dark; even with the large windows in the mid-bath, the interior feels confined and dim to me. If one is making the choice without actually having spent some time inside an LD with this interior, I suggest doing so if possible before ordering.
As ever, YMMV.
One more opinion on the cherry "wood" interior; it may look nice when new. BUT every little scratch or scuff mark on the woodwork shows to the extreme. Especially in front of the kitchen sink and in the lavatory where there tends to be much contact.
We've looked at a fair amount of used units over the years and the cherry woodwork just doesn't hold up.
Steve K
We like the darker wood and after over 10 years full timing I would get it again. But, as everyone keeps saying YMMV.
Steve is correct that the darker wood is going to show flaws easier than the lighter and that the cabinet doors near water are going to suffer more in appearance although not more in terms of damage. We have lightly sanded those doors and coated with polyurethane twice and it looks good. In fact, we did that on drawer faces in those areas as well and were happy with the result.
Jim
Guess we are “gloomy people” 😂
As stated here, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.....we love our color combination though we did have the factory this year change out the Formica on our dinette table from the very “busy” pattern used in 2013 to the one currently used...
Good luck!!!
At the risk of 'jumping on' I'm a 'gloomy' fan. I agree it 'shows' or 'highlights' assorted bumps and abrasions faster. A few years ago when we stopped at the factory for a refresh we bought a small container of factory approved retouch paint. To me the 'darkness' makes me feel cooler in hot weather. But as they (I do wonder who they is) say 'to each their own'.
glen
Be aware that the silver exterior paint is the worse color for fading, with the red a close second.
Larry