Were the 2000 and 2001 E450 chassis delivered to the factory with 75W140 Synthetic rear end lubrication?
Aad Rommelse
Do you have access to the chassis manual?
For 2017 Ford specifies 80W-90 conventional - see photo and attached PDF of manual for reference.
Thanks for your response Renegade 242. Unfortunately my transaxle tag is missing. Consequently, I am looking for the type of rear end that I have in my 2001 Lazy Daze. On page 2000 of the 2001 Owner's Guide E-Series under Capacities and Specifications it does indeed call SAE80W-90 Premium rear Axle lubricant. However, on page 196, under the same subject, it made a reference to a footnote 4, Dana Model 80, which require SAE 75W-140 Synthetic.
On the incomplete DOT weight sticker I found a reference 86. Despite some research, I have not been able to identify this. From various blogs I understand that there has been a lot of confusion about this subject when the tags are missing.
My main purpose is to find out if I can change to an approved synthetic 75W-140 rear axle lubricant, which I really like to do..
Aad
Hello Aad - here are two ways to identify your axle:
1) either a "70" or "80" will be cast into location #3 per the image below.
2) copy down the BOM number at location #2 on the axle tube and search for it at: Dana Spicer / The Expert / Heavy Axle (http://www2.dana.com/expertforms/demenu.aspx?prod=HAX)
That is great information. Needless to say that I am crawling underneath to look for the numbers. I hope it is a 80, which calls for 75W-140 Synthetic. Thanks for this guidance.
Aad
Well, I spent some time underneath our 2001 Lazy Daze MB. Despite a lot of cleaning I could not find a model number anywhere. Judging by the shape of the differential and its cover I am almost convinced that it is a Dana 80. I did find BOM number 606207 3 stamped in the tube. However, despite looking at quite a few list from Dana etc. I could not find this number.
After some good cleaning I discovered that I still do have the label fastened to the differential. It confirmed the number on the tube with the following 4.56 V YG25ZA.
The following was stamped in the differential cover: 477717 3
192 O
REV D
06 14 99 (must be manufacturing date)
I always assumed that I had a Dana differential which had been lubed at the factory for life with synthetic lubrication. Am I wrong?
Aad
I seriously doubt your 2001 came with synthetic rear axle lubricant. My 2003 did not.
If you believe the lubricant inside it is original, here is one way to check to see if it is standard gear lube or synthetic. Put on some gloves, remove the plug on the axle where you would check the lubricant level, and stick a gloved finger in the hole and smell the lube. Every synthetic rear axle lube I have ever encountered smells really nasty. The standard lube just smells like a petroleum product.
I had a Ford dealer replace my lubricant with synthetic lube. It was no big deal other than synthetic lubricant was fairly expensive. I thought it was worth the investment.
So just give it the "sniff test"! And make sure you wear gloves when you handle synthetic gear lube.
Steve K.
Steve, Your experience confuses me even more. As I mentioned before, from reading the various blogs and other searches, I understood that most, if not all, E450 cutaways were supplied with Model 80 rear axles. Although I could not find a stamped confirmation the differential housing shape confirms this. In my 2001 Owner's Guide for the 2001 E-Series it has a foot note 4, that clearly calls for Motorcraft 75W-140 synthetic. In addition, No where in the 2001 Model Year Scheduled Maintenance Guide do I find a reference to servicing the differential.
Larry, could you please way in on this subject?
Aad
Hello Aad - I did some searching and found your BOM in this PDF - you have a Dana 70 with a 267 mm ring gear which is the correct size. Please see the attached picture and PDF for reference.
Additional information should you ever require replacement parts - see JPG below.
Wow. I have been searching all over for this BOM Number. You must be a lot smarter than I am. Judging by the 4.56 ratio, which complies with the Lazy Daze factory information, can we assume that most of the Lazy Daze cutaways have the Dana 70 differential units? This also explains why Steve had SAE80W90 in his unit. Another lesson learned by an amateur mechanic.
Aad
Aad,
I just went to our LD and got out my owner's manual and it appears my 2003 Ford E450 chassis has the 10.5 inch M70 axle. According to my owner's manual, it came with Motorcraft 80w-90 Premium Rear Axle Lubricant.
A close read of the 2003 scheduled maintenace guide says that the rear axle lubricant should be replaced at 150,000 miles. It also mentions changing the rear axle bubricant every 3000 miles during extended trailer towing above 70°F (or 3 months) . It further states that the 3000 mile interval may be waived IF the axle was filled with 75w140 synthetic gear lubricant meeting Ford specification WSL-M2C192-A.
At 96,000 miles, I had my servicing Ford dealer perform a rear axle service. I DO NOT tow. I told them I wanted to use synthetic lubricant. My understanding was they flushed out the differential and charged me for 4 qts. of BG 75w140 Synthetic Ultra Lube that states on the bottle it meets Ford specs. They installed the amount needed and gave me (at my request) the approximately 1/2 quart that was left over. They also added some "friction modifier". Total charge back in May 2011 was around $170.
I hope this info will be helpful to you.
Steve K
Thanks Steve. Wow, what an education can one get via this group. The mileage of our rigs are within 1000 miles. Needles to say that I feel much better now. Yes, I plan to remove the cover, clean the sump etc. and change to 75W140, Ford approved, Synthetic and the friction modifier. My project for next Monday.
Aad
Hi Aad,
Glad to share the info. Our 2003 LD is now close to 135,000 miles and going strong. I tend to be pro-active on maintenance items and I am a strong advocate for synthetic lubricants.
I hope your job goes smoothly. I admire folks who are willing to tackle jobs like this themselves. My skill set ends at oil and filter changes.
Good luck,
Steve K.
Our 2003 23.5' FL has a Dana 70 HD and so should other 2003 models.
Axle rebuild-D70 HD | Flickr (https://www.flickr.com/photos/lwade/sets/72157681746622164/)
Do not attempt this at home! it was one of toughest things I have rebuilt.
While the axle comes with 80w-90 fluid, it can also use the 75w140 synthetic gear lube.
150,000 miles is way too long for a fluid change, I suggest changing it at 50,000 or less if you tow a heavy vehicle.
Unless the axle has a limited slip differential, a friction modifier is not needed and is a waste of money.
Out 2003 LD's rear axle died at 100,000 miles, after spinning a pinion shaft bearing. It had been filled with 75w140 synthetic gear lube since the first change at 50K. Pulling a 4000-lb Jeep over hundreds of steep passes didn't help things.
Larry
Larry,
Is it reasonable to assume that all the cutaways delivered to the Lazy Daze factory were non-limited slip 70 HD differentials?
I had no intend to rebuild ours. Just service and clean out the sump etc. Needless to say that I have never done such a project before, but judging by instructions on youtube, it does not seem to difficult.
Aad
Is it reasonable to assume that all the cutaways delivered to the Lazy Daze factory were non-limited slip 70 HD differentials?
I had no intend to rebuild ours. Just service and clean out the sump etc. Needless to say that I have never done such a project before, but judging by instructions on youtube, it does not seem to difficult.
According to my experiences and what I have read, all LDs of my vintage came with a D70 HD and did not have a limited slip.
Once the differential cover is off and the fluid drained, a trained eye can identify if the carrier is open or has a limited slip differential.
Remove cover, drain and wash the interior out with solvent. I use a spray brake cleaner that evaporates quickly .
Clean the cover and axle of any old sealant. Apply a thin layer of oil resistant RTV silicone to the cover, surrounding all the bolt holes, and then mount and install the bolts.
Fill using a hand pump.
Amazon.com: Slippery Pete Quart Fluid Transfer Pump, Extract Oil From Quart... (https://www.amazon.com/Slippery-Pete-Transmission-Differential-Antifreeze/dp/B07CX4XKFH/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1531078473&sr=8-2&keywords=Slippery+Pete+Quart+Fluid+Transfer+Pump)
Not much to it other than the mess and the hassle of getting far under the rig, to access the axle cover.
Larry
Larry,
As you may recall a few years ago I changed the front and rear brakes of our 2001 MB. Neither at that time nor today do I see any evidence of leaking wheel seals. Should I leave this alone until they start leaking, or is now the time to pull the axles and change the seals and bearings.
Aad
" If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
Build the "RV Emergency Fund!"
Most of us just tinker with the house for our living convienance.
As you may recall a few years ago I changed the front and rear brakes of our 2001 MB. Neither at that time nor today do I see any evidence of leaking wheel seals. Should I leave this alone until they start leaking, or is now the time to pull the axles and change the seals and bearings.
At 109,000 miles, I have never touched the rear wheel bearings, they have remained tight, smooth and leak free. The rear wheel bearing have a continuous source of lubricating fluid, using the same lube reservoir as the differential.
You would need a special socket to loosen and remove the rear wheel bearing locking nuts.
Our front wheel seals have been replaced during each full brake job that includes either replacing or cleaning and repacking the wheel bearings with grease. The front wheel seal must be removed to change or pack the bearings. Never reuse an old wheel seal, the are cheap and easy to replace .
Make sure to use a high-temperature disc brake grease for the front wheel bearings.
Check and lube the brake slides every other year.
Larry
Thanks Larry. I was hoping for such a reply. It was just a thought when I went through some of the you tube pictures.
Aad