What do you use as a toad? Just curious as I am considering finding something to pull.
2016 Subaru Forester. It is also my everyday car.
First decide what you want from your toad. We tow a '13 Honda Fit, last year that model was towable. However, we can't go off-road, and have to be judicious about certain rough road travel. Ironically, most poor road travel is no problem for our '04 FL, which can present a dilemma, and require un-hitching. Still, any 'off-road' we prefer foot travel anyway, so this solution gives us the mobility we want for most destinations, stress on the rig is minimized, and we can sight-see extensively with very low fuel costs. If the latter is not part of any trip, we just leave the toad at home. A 24' rig solo can be maneuvered through most parking and other travel situations, as we had done for the 20 years prior to the toad. That's our story...
Steve
I guess I should have said a toad for flat towing with a automatic. I have a Nissan Xterra I would like to tow but it is heavy and nissan says it can't be towed with an auto transmission.
Duro, have you looked at the several articles on Toads and Towing in The Companion?
Here's one
The Lazy Daze Companion: Tow Vechiles (http://lazydazearticles.blogspot.com/search/label/Tow%20Vechiles)
I guess I should have said a toad for flat towing with a automatic. I have a Nissan Xterra I would like to tow but it is heavy and nissan says it can't be towed with an auto transmission.
I should have added our Fit is auto, and is also our everyday driver. A friend with a MB has towed 1st gen 2wd auto CRV's for years. Though older, they are reliable, roomy for driver, good cargo room, fairly lightweight, and decent bad and off-road access. No Jeep trails, tho...
Steve
Don't want to tow a vehicle? Ever consider an electric bicycle? While it's not a solution for every toad need, we have been using ours for:
Extended pleasure riding pulling a trailer with our aging dog along for the ride.
Running errands - If there is a town 15 miles or so away, it's an easy run to re-provision.
There are full suspension mountain bike versions - off road adventures!
Range varies widely, depending on battery size and human input, but a typical pedal assisted range is about 40 miles with out breaking much of a sweat.
Here's a link reviewing most decent ebikes:
Electric Bike Review (https://electricbikereview.com)
Or build using your own bike with kits from here:
Luna Cycle Kits (https://lunacycle.com/motors/)
Regardless, avoid really inexpensive ebikes if you go down this road. You will regret it later when they fall apart or run out of range after 20 miles...
Pete
Don't want to tow a vehicle? Ever consider an electric bicycle? While it's not a solution for every toad need, we have been using ours for:
Pete
We took a test ride on the ebike yesterday and it was a blast. Introducing the Turbo Como | Specialized.com (https://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo-como)
We aren't seriously considering this over our Subaru but we were in the shop for something else and gave it a try. If I lived in a town without lousy traffic I would love to get around on one of these.
Shop owner claimed 40-60 mile range but I see that Specialized doesn't address range unless I'm missing something.
Jim
Peter a bike would be fun but I need something large enough to carry a couple people and a 89 lb dog.
Although not technically a "toad", we have been pulling a small trailer with a motorcycle and two bicycles for over a decade, previously behind our camper and now behind the Lazy Daze. The down-side: Bicycles and motorcycles are inconvenient in really hot weather, rain, and nocturnal travels. We don't find cold to be a problem, but we don't ride in snow; of course I don't like to drive in snow either.
The good side: We can, however carry quite a bit of groceries and supplies on the motorcycle and visit places where we would think twice about taking a car. Parking is never a problem anywhere, even when parking lots are packed. Fuel consumption is almost insignificant. People almost always talk to us at gas stops and visitor centers, much more so than when we are traveling in a four wheel vehicle. Nearly all of the cool places we have visited over the years have been on the motorcycle.
The little trailer is easy to maneuver and when sites are too short, I disconnect and put the trailer elsewhere. I have never crashed with my bride at pillion and she is so relaxed on the back that she sometimes falls asleep while we are riding. She regularly reads a book while we pass through the less stimulating areas and rides no-hands to take pictures when she feels moved to do so.
Motorcycles aren't for everyone, but it has been a great alternative to a four wheel toad for us. Did I mention that it is ALWAYS fun?!
Photo from the Olympic peninsula with Will G., another Lazy Daze owner and forum member.
HD
Had Lee Iacocca E-Bikes back in the day including having them at the Lazy Daze 50th Anniversary get together in Cheyenne. Too much fun. Took them downtown and had dinner one night so if you were there you know that was a pretty impressive there and back for what were, unfortunately, an idea before their time. The company went belly up and when the batteries finally gave out we were stuck with hunks of iron that are long out of our lives.
I would think new technology is far advanced but once burned, twice shy. If anyone has extensive experience with one LASTING and have the ability to get replacement battieries I might give them another go.
BTW, our present toad is a 2016 Subaru Crosstrek, manny tranny. Love it. Subaru no longer recommends flat towing their rigs. LAWYERS TALKING. They are still towable and we have thousands of miles of towing with Soobie (and Ruby. I’m a poet and didn’t know it!)
Duro,
We flat tow a 2013 Honda CRV and use the Blue Ox Alladin aluminum tow bar. We only tow on longer trips but this set up works extremely well for us as this is my wife's everyday vehicle. It is lightweight and the tow bar is very easy to use. I believe that 2014 is the last year the CRV is towable. The only issue is that there is an accessory fuse under the dash that needs removed if you tow for long periods of time. I have found that if the fuse is not removed, after approx. 6 hours the CRV will need jumped. If it is removed I have never had any issues, even for two days.
Hopefully this helps, Paul
Thanks Paul. Sure wish I would have been thinking about a toad 6 months ago. My mom sold her CRV when she decided she couldn’t drive anymore.
Just traded in my 2012 Honda Fit for a 2014 Honda CRV. Now I just need to get it outfitted with the same tow gear my dad has on his CRV. Now when borrowing the LD I won’t need to take his car away from him. 😊🚐
We had a 2015 Pilot but traded down for the CRV because it seemed too big and we wanted to be able to tow if needed. We actually like the CRV much better than the newer Pilot. We had a 2004 Pilot for years and our CRV seems much more similar in size. It is too bad that the new CRV is not towable. Anyhow, we love it.
The only issue is that there is an accessory fuse under the dash that needs removed if you tow for long periods of time.
Paul
Add a charge line for the toad battery via the umbilical cord and you wont have to pull that fuse any more! ;)
In my NSHO, you misspelled 'towd'.
We bought a 1996 Toyota RAV4 the first year they came out and ran it for 16 years during which time we had a number of travel trailers and trucks to pull them. When we replaced it in 2011 we looked at the Rav4, Honda CRV, and Suburu Forester. Based on history we bought a 2011 Rav4. In 2013, we decided to go RV instead of TT and selected LD. Our '11 Rav4 needed a transmission pump to tow which voided the warranty. We opted for an '11 CRV coming off lease, and dropped $3K into towd conversion. I selected Roadmaster Falcon All-terrain tow pkg, but in retrospect might go for the Blue Ox for the amount of hardware on display when not towing.
I am satisfied with the CRV AWD for light ORV - rock crawler it is not. It also functions as the shed for stuff to keep the 31 IB under the GVWR and hitch limit of 4K. The Stay-n-play brake system works well. I added a cutoff switch for the daytime running lights and don't usually have a problem with the battery when towing (on a long slog of 3-4 days w/o stopping an running the towd, the battery may get a bit feeble).
I bought a '96 tacoma 4x4 manual with a possible eye to converting that to a towd, but the jury is still out on the cost of converting that to a towd.
YMMV
Joel & dogs
I added a cutoff switch for the daytime running lights and don't usually have a problem with the battery when towing (on a long slog of 3-4 days w/o stopping an running the towd, the battery may get a bit feeble).
Why would the DRLs come on with the engine off? They don't in our '13 Fit.
Steve
Joel,
A vehicle that is towed is called a “toad” in the RV world. Some prefer the word “dinghy,” borrowing from the nautical world, meaning a smaller craft pulled behind a larger craft. 😊
After losing a towed dinghy in heavy seas, we now carry the dinghy and tow the "toad".
Other advantages to pulling a small trailer is that we can carry firewood, extra gear, and the propane fire pit in addition to the bikes, and it is still less than 2500lb total weight. It is easy to back out of situations that require a change in direction (tight exit fuel stations) , and tongue weight can be controlled by the placement of heavy items fore and aft of the axle. I aim at a 15% tongue weight (less than 400lb.) for towing stability. Having flat towed a vehicle in the past, one has to be thoughtful about one's path because if you can't back up with a flat towed vehicle.
Did I mention that motorcycles and bicycles are fun?
HD
Did I mention that motorcycles and bicycles are fun?
HD
Yes they are, and so is a Vespa, our toad for the last 9 Years. 😀 — Jon
Like HD, taking the motorcycle along hits all the right buttons for us. However, with two large dogs that we like to take away from camp for remote exploring - a car is nice as well.
We get both with our setup...albeit, with only one motorcycle. When we both ride, bringing two bikes - the dogs will stay home and we'll tow the enclosed trailer.
Photo and story of our first trip with the Vespa on rack. Wow. Time does fly indeed.
Houn's Journal: CA to AZ: A Lot of Desert (http://hounsjournal.blogspot.com/2008/09/ca-to-az-lot-of-desert.html)
-Jon
Syspig does it right: motorcycles, dogs, and a car. All bases are covered!
HD
The only issue is that there is an accessory fuse under the dash that needs removed if you tow for long periods of time.
Paul
Add a charge line for the toad battery via the umbilical cord and you wont have to pull that fuse any more! ;)
Steve,
Can this work with a four to four connecter using the factory plug on the LD? I thought this was only for lighting. I appreciate the advice.
Paul
Paul
No, you will need to change out the four pin connectors and the umbilical cord for a six connector arrangement. Likewise on the toad and the LD. You can pick up an 'always on' 12v source from the wiring loom midway of the under side of the coach. Don't forget a fuse just prior to the toad battery. It might be wise to have an RV shop do the work. The six wire umbilical will offer you one wire for the 12v charge line, four wires for lights and a spare for future needs. ;)
In your search for flat towable vehicles, Motorhome Magazine publishes an annual list of toads.
Here is a link to past 14 years recommendations.
Towing Guide | Serving the Seattle Everett Washington area (https://www.royrobinsonrv.com/rv-towing-guide-washington)
Knowing what kinds of roads that you intend driving on should determine the type of toad.
If the roughest road you might drive on is paved or a good, maintained gravel road, a small car, fit the Fit, it's a good choice.
If the unknown dirt road is enticing, a higher clearance vehicle, like the CRV or a Subaru, should be considered.
For true off road conditions, a two-door Wrangler will just make the 4000-lb cutoff.
Think it over before committing to a toad. Besides the purchase price, figure around $3000 for a complete towing setup.
If you have not towed before, be prepared for a very different experience.
Having a toad opens up a world of exploration that isn't practical in a motorhome.
We have done it both ways and would never go back to being toad-less.
Larry
A couple points to add to the great comments so far.
I tow a 2007 Jeep Liberty 4x4 automatic, had an 05 a few years ago. Both tow great and are almost as offroad capable as a Wrangler. Recently had the current Liberty weighed and it came in at 4060# with full gas tank and some other stuff in the back.
Also if someone is mechanically handy they can cut the price of the towing equipment down a bit by installing it themselves. I've installed both the Liberty and a Z71 Silverado.
Think it over before committing to a toad. Besides the purchase price, figure around $3000 for a complete towing setup.
Larry
Larry I saw this in my area and thought it would help keep the high costs down.
RV Tow Kit - general for sale - by owner (https://seattle.craigslist.org/est/for/d/rv-tow-kit/6446906724.html)
Although my Xterra is a little over 4000 lbs I sure would like to figure out how to tow it. From what I have read I would have to disconnect the rear driveline to tow flat. Remco doesn't make a disconnect for it anymore. I don't think unhooking the driveline would be that big of deal only being 4 bolts. But the wife doesn't like the idea at all.
If you think Larry's 3K is off, this is what I paid for a Falcon All Terrain, Stay-N-Play brake system in 2014:
Falcon Base Plate $429.00
Install $49.00
Falcon All Terrain $799.00
Faclcon Acc. Kit $289.00
Install $49.00
Labor $58.00
Shipping $45.00
Tax $117.00
Stay N Play $887.00
Install $569.00
Total $3,291.00
Tow bar was purchased and installed at Camping World when they had a $49 installation sale which avoided another $479 labor. Stay-N-Play installed at Idle Wheels RV in Placerville, CA
The mothership installed a 7 pin connector instead of the 4 pin. I had to provide the connector but they did the install when building. Might be something to think about if you are getting a new one.
lthough my Xterra is a little over 4000 lbs I sure would like to figure out how to tow it. From what I have read I would have to disconnect the rear driveline to tow flat. Remco doesn't make a disconnect for it anymore. I don't think unhooking the driveline would be that big of deal only being 4 bolts. But the wife doesn't like the idea at all.
Here's the rub... You cannot back up with the toad attached. Eventually, you will encounter a situation where you need to go back and will need to disconnect to continue. I doubt you will want to include sliding under the toad to re-attach the driveline, then again to detach after re-hitched, added to the hassle of the whole process. Perhaps you can find the discontinued remote disconnect as a used item...
Steve
Here's the rub... You cannot back up with the toad attached. Eventually, you will encounter a situation where you need to go back and will need to disconnect to continue. I doubt you will want to include sliding under the toad to re-attach the driveline, then again to detach after re-hitched, added to the hassle of the whole process. Perhaps you can find the discontinued remote disconnect as a used item...
Steve
Yea Steve I just crawled under the Xterra (tight fit lol) and unhooking the driveline isn't something I want to do on a regular basis. Getting to all the bolts is almost impossible without jacking up the rearend so the wheels will spin freely.
Here's the rub... You cannot back up with the toad attached. Eventually, you will encounter a situation where you need to go back and will need to disconnect to continue. I doubt you will want to include sliding under the toad to re-attach the driveline, then again to detach after re-hitched,
Yep, it's going to happen, probably more than once, most likely on a rainy day. Been there a few times.
The towing kit shown doesn't include an Xterra baseplate but does include a portable brake unit, the type known to to sometimes shift, unknowingly engaging the toad's brakes.
I have seen two toads burned to the ground when this has happened and not noticed until it's too late.
Larry
The towing kit shown doesn't include an Xterra baseplate but does include a portable brake unit, the type known to to sometimes shift, unknowingly engaging the toad's brakes.
I have seen two toads burned to the ground when this has happened and not noticed until it's too late.
Larry
Thanks for that info Larry on the brake unit. Is this a better choice?
STERLING TOW BAR by ROADMASTER - general for sale - by owner (https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/for/d/sterling-tow-bar-by-roadmaster/6438261932.html)
Thanks for that info Larry on the brake unit. Is this a better choice?
STERLING TOW BAR by ROADMASTER - general for sale - by owner (https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/for/d/sterling-tow-bar-by-roadmaster/6438261932.html)
The Brakemaster 9000 is for DPs, with air brakes.
It will not work with your LD.
The tow bar is fine.
Larry
With the comments about not being able to backup. Just how big of job is it to hookup and unhook the toads? I’m use to my little boat which is very simple.
With the comments about not being able to backup. Just how big of job is it to hookup and unhook the toads? I’m use to my little boat which is very simple.
I'm on my first trip w/toad, and I've got it down to about 5 minutes. The first few times took maybe 10...primarily out of a healthy dose of paranoia. I still have the paranoia, but I'm down to double-checking everything instead of triple-checking. 8)
I'm sure the seasoned professionals here will offer up more and/or better wisdom, but I'd highly recommend a checklist.
We tow a 2017 Chevy Sonic, 4-door, automatic. It's large enough to carry the grandkids when we are visiting them and when we're not, the trunk is large enough to keep our satellite dish, grill and other odds and ends. The only thing that has to be done is bypass one fuse when towing. We took it on the road last summer with us and put 9,000 towing miles on her. We don't off-road, so it works great and it is easy on gas.
It will depend on the towing equipment. Ours is very simple....we use the Blue Ox Aladdin tow bar and Blue Ox base plate as well. The Aladdin is great because each bar adjusts outward, up and down and side to side with no problems (it sold me because it is great on not so even terrain). You simply park the toad behind, pull the bars up from the storage position, loosen the levers and each arm then attaches to the toad using a pin and lynchpin. When you need to remove, simply reverse. We have very rarely had to adjust the position of the car to remove. I have also removed simple boat trailers and find this much quicker and easier without the cranking up and down to adjust the trailer!!
We have not towed anything with our LD but have towed all sorts of items with other vehicles. I have looked for information on the LDO about towing with a two wheeled Dolly but could not find anything. A friend has been talked into towing a Toyota corolla behind an SOB with a two wheeled Dolly. I am sure there has been discussions about dolly towing vs flat tow. Our friend has the corolla as their toad and don't want to change the car and they were told that the corolla will not flat tow so they will have to tow it with the two wheeled dolly.
Karen~Liam
26 ~ MB
With the comments about not being able to backup. Just how big of job is it to hookup and unhook the toads? I’m use to my little boat which is very simple.
While most of the time, hooking and unhooking are simple, there are time where most tow bars get jammed up and will not release without moving the toad. Some of the better tow bars have stronger release mechanisms that will release under heavy pressure .
Our tow bar uses a conventional ball hitch and does not have easy to release arms.
The hitch can be hard to pop off, so I keep a pry bar close by when unhooking, storing it in the Jeep's back seat, for quick access.
Beyond this, it is very easy to hook or unhook, taking only a minute or so.
When running into a dead end, where I cannot turn around without unhooking, it only take five minutes to spin things around...I still hate it and will go great distance to avoid doing so.
Larry
With the Falcon All Terrain tow bar I need to disconnect 6 things: 2 locking pins which secures the tow bars to the RV, 2 safety cables, electrical cable, breakaway switch wire. Usually fairly easy, with exceptions. One of them was Feb 16 in 2' of snow in Tonopah NV gas station. Lost traction exiting and had to back out. Tow bar release, locking pins, safety cables all iced over in snow country. Took a bit of convincing to get them to move. :(
I think that's where Orwan developed an allergy to snow chains ;)
Just need a big enough toad to tow the LD backwards. My Suburban 2500 is an easy flat-tow, since the transfer case has a push-button Neutral. A svelte 6800 lbs. or so; only twice the OEM LD tow rating... :)
Chip
I forgot to mention.....I would suggest the Blue Ox Aladdin aluminum tow bar. It is much lighter if you remove for storage. We looked at both the aluminum and steel and preferred the aluminum ten fold.
Paul
I forgot to mention.....I would suggest the Blue Ox Aladdin aluminum tow bar. It is much lighter if you remove for storage. We looked at both the aluminum and steel and preferred the aluminum ten fold.
Paul
Only a 10 lb difference between, but about $175 more for the aluminum. Removing a well-secured tow bar from the LD is a real chore - in our case we have a locking pin and U-clamp for rigidity and security, and cover it when not in use. If you absolutely need to pull it off frequently, then the lighter bar might be a slight advantage, but the best solution is to find away around that so you can leave it attached. In use, the models are equivalent, with a similar design.
Steve
We towed a Subaru Forester 2001 for 7 years and and now the same in a 2016 for the last 2 years. Works flawlessly. No modifications (except towbar baseplate, of course). Manual transmission. Ted
Towed a 2007 Subaru Forester for years. Went to replace it and the newer Foresters are substantially heavier so dropped down to a Crosstrek which weights 3109 pounds; about the same as the old Forester. That makes sense since both were built on the Impreza chassis.
Recollection of curb weight of newer Forester was something like 3,600 pounds. Fill it up with fluids plus towed goodies got me closer to the 4,000 limit than I was comfortable with.
Yes, manual tranny. Getting harder and harder to find manny tranny’s!
Went to the Blue Ox factory since it’s only a few hours away to get the base plate attached. They charge more but I want the experts installing my safety equipment more than I want an extra $100 in my checking account. Turned out my old tow bar was shot. I authorized replacement with a higher end bar (the brown one, 10,000 weight limit). However, I hadn’t removed that bar in years and it was stuck in there good and tight. They couldn’t even winch it out with a power winch. This was late in the season and it was chilly which they believed was the reason it wouldn’t budge with a winch. We agreed to leave Ruby there. They stored her indoors and then warmed the metal further. They tried winching it out again. In talking to the guy who helped us (can’t remember his name now, good guy) he said it wasn’t coming free then all of a sudden it just popped out with a sound like a gunshot through their factory. Startled everyone in the place. We had a good chuckle over that!
Moral of the story; I remove my tow bar after each use. Yes, it weighs nearly 40 pounds and is a PITA to take on and off but I don’t want to have that happen again.
Only a 10 lb difference between, but about $175 more for the aluminum. Removing a well-secured tow bar from the LD is a real chore - in our case we have a locking pin and U-clamp for rigidity and security, and cover it when not in use. If you absolutely need to pull it off frequently, then the lighter bar might be a slight advantage, but the best solution is to find away around that so you can leave it attached. In use, the models are equivalent, with a similar design.
Steve
We have never had an issue with ours. Ours is very simple to install and remove and we use a locking pin as well. Unfortunately, I need to remove when we are at home because for one I believe it would drag on our drive because of grade when parking for storage and two, I prefer to store either in our garage when home or in of the LD compartments when traveling. I don't want to take any chances.
Paul
After looking at the Dingy guide posted earlier. I am finding it hard to find something that I like that meets our needs lol. Not many choices with a automatic transmission and lightweight.
I always thought a classic would be fun....mgb or convertible vw beetle. Maybe someday!
One of our toad options...
(The other is hiding behind the trailer. Sneaky little thing.)
Chip
I always thought a classic would be fun....mgb or convertible vw beetle. Maybe someday!
Manual transmission, VW Bugs are flat towable.
Larry
Something like this, perhaps?
I thought a Baja Bug painted to match the LD would be very cool. But was shot down on that idea lol.
Mazda Miata MX-5 with a MT?
“Mazda Miata MX-5 with a MT?“
According to the boss it has to be a automatic and have cargo space for our large Doberman. The automatic is really the limiting factor. After a lot of reading I think we need to look at a Ford Escape or Chevy HHR.
“Mazda Miata MX-5 with a MT?“
According to the boss it has to be a automatic and have cargo space for our large Doberman. The automatic is really the limiting factor. After a lot of reading I think we need to look at a Ford Escape or Chevy HHR.
We towed an HHR for the first 4 years. The ground clearance is 6.5" but it looks lower than that. Gas mileage wasn't all that great and it seems to have a tiny windshield. That's why we bought a 2011 Forester, but, of course, it has an MT.
Jim
... I think we need to look at a Ford Escape ...
I was considering an Escape when researching toads last year but scratched it from the list due to reports of transmission issues after towing. Could be a lot of folks had no problem and only hear about the complaints but seemed to be too many to ignore and there are other choices.
Rich
I think having a toad is a good idea. There are just some places you should not take a RV.
We towed an HHR for the first 4 years. The ground clearance is 6.5" but it looks lower than that. Gas mileage wasn't all that great and it seems to have a tiny windshield. That's why we bought a 2011 Forester, but, of course, it has an MT.
Jim
Was the HHR a dependable car? Which motor did it have and how was the power?
Was the HHR a dependable car? Which motor did it have and how was the power?
It had the 2.2L motor. We had it for 4 years and had no issues with it. There is one fuse you need to pull although I installed a switch that allowed us to turn it off when towing.
Jim
Duro, another possible option for a toad that is large enough for your dog is the Chevy Colorado/GMC Canyon. I believe they are towable with automatic transmission. You could always throw a camper shell on for the pooch. I would target an older one as they are a little lighter.
Duro, another possible option for a toad that is large enough for your dog is the Chevy Colorado/GMC Canyon. I believe they are towable with automatic transmission. You could always throw a camper shell on for the pooch. I would target an older one as they are a little lighter.
Bare GMC 4X4 Canyons weight 4000-lb and upwards.
An upgraded hitch is needed.
Larry
Bare GMC 4X4 Canyons weight 4000-lb and upwards.
An upgraded hitch is needed.
Larry
Probably true for newer models, Larry, but note that the older ones weigh less. For example, a 2010 4x2 extended cab model has a curb weight of 3,500 lbs:
2010 GMC Canyon SLT 4x2 Extended Cab 6 ft. box 126 in. WB | Cars.com (https://www.cars.com/research/gmc-canyon-2010/specs/usc00gmt222b0/)
One of our toad options...
(The other is hiding behind the trailer. Sneaky little thing.)
Chip
COne of our toad options...
(The other is hiding behind the trailer. Sneaky little thing.)
Chip
Chip,
Very nice looking Alpine. I have always like them. I still miss all my LBCs (Little British Cars), a 62 Healey tricarb, 03 and 06 Coopers.
I was considering an Escape when researching toads last year but scratched it from the list due to reports of transmission issues after towing. Could be a lot of folks had no problem and only hear about the complaints but seemed to be too many to ignore and there are other choices.
Rich
Thanks Rich!! I did a search and did some reading and I don't like what I read. I think I will pass on the escape too.
I owned a Ford Escape when I bought my 2004 30'IB and intended to tow it. A bit of research at that time told me that the Escape cannot be towed! I even consulted Remco to see if they had a device that would allow four down towing. No such luck!
That's when I bought a Honda Civic and then, later, a Honda CRV. :(
In the past, the Ford Ranger pickup has been a toad recommended by Motorhome magazine. US Production stopped in 2011, although the vehicle continued to be produced in other parts of the world. On a recent overseas trip, I noticed new Rangers in Hong Kong and the Philippines and they looked pretty nice.
I noticed that Ford is bringing back the Ranger to US production starting with the 2019 model. Unknown at this time what the weight specs will be, or if it will even be towable 4-down, but it may be a viable toad in the future:
Ford Ranger is back - Jan. 14, 2018 (http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/14/autos/ford-ranger-reveal/index.html)
In the past, the Ford Ranger pickup has been a toad recommended by Motorhome magazine. US Production stopped in 2011, although the vehicle continued to be produced in other parts of the world
I noticed that Ford is bringing back the Ranger to US production starting with the 2019 model. Unknown at this time what the weight specs will be but it may be a viable toad in the future:
Ford Ranger is back - Jan. 14, 2018 (http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/14/autos/ford-ranger-reveal/index.html)
The older 4X4 Rangers make decent toads, being very lightweight.
I consider one a few years ago but backed off when finding very little upgraded suspension parts were available, unlike the Jeep's vast world of aftermarket parts.
It seems all newer vehicles are heavier. The new Ranger will probably be in the same weight range as the GMC Canyon, which come in at 4000+lbs bare, a bit heavy .
To tow, it will require 4X4 and a transfer-case with a true neutral, just like most other towable 4X4s.
Larry
Yea Larry that’s what I am noticing. Same model newer vehicles are 100’s of pounds heavier. And older used vehicles have to many miles for my liking.
Yea Larry that’s what I am noticing. Same model newer vehicles are 100’s of pounds heavier. And older used vehicles have to many miles for my liking.
Duro, I agree the new Ranger will probably be too heavy but we won't know for sure until the specs come out. You can find used lower mileage vehicles, though, if you look hard enough. I just purchased a 2003 Chevy S-10 4x2 w/auto. with just under 70K miles (not towable to my knowledge; too bad as it meets the weight requirement). It will work as a trash and grocery hauler, though.
They are out there!
Duro, I agree the new Ranger will probably be too heavy but we won't know for sure until the specs come out. You can find used lower mileage vehicles, though, if you look hard enough. I just purchased a 2003 Chevy S-10 4x2 w/auto. with just under 70K miles (not towable to my knowledge; too bad as it meets the weight requirement). It will work as a trash and grocery hauler, though.
They are out there!
A review in today’s LA Times said the new Ranger is now a midsize, up from compact. Competes now with Tacoma, Colorado, Frontier, etc. No specs available. — Jon
Good article, Jon. After reading it, I'm fairly certain the new Ranger's will be too heavy to tow, at least not without some hitch modification. Hopefully the specs will be out soon.
New Ford Bronco, Ranger - Details on the 2019 Ford Ranger & 2020 Ford Bronco (http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/future-cars/a31079/new-ford-bronco-ranger-details/)
guessing that bronco will be even heavier than the ranger... but, probably more fun. can always go old school....
“can always go old school....“
Yea old school would be fun. I would love to have a first generation Blazer or Bronco to play with.
"I would love to have a first generation Blazer or Bronco to play with."
I had a 1977 GMC Jimmy (like the Chevy Blazer) until it was stolen in 1996! It was an incredible gas hog at 8 MPG! Several years before, I parked it and bought a Toyota Tercel. Didn't trade it in because it really didn't need to be on the road.
Apparently someone wanted the engine, because when they found it, the hood and engine were gone. But the mag wheels remained intact!
Virtual hugs,
Judie <-- Sierra Vista, Arizona
Adventures of Dorrie Anne | Photographing the West (http://dorrieanne.wordpress.com)
Today: Gaucho Hat and Colorful Serape
**********************************
“can always go old school....“
Yea old school would be fun. I would love to have a first generation Blazer or Bronco to play with.
Better hurry on this one, only 2 days left to bid:
1974 Ford Bronco White | eBay (https://www.ebay.com/itm/1974-Ford-Bronco-White/292407572640?hash=item4414d978a0:g:azcAAOSwDkVaL0L5&vxp=mtr)
"I would love to have a first generation Blazer or Bronco to play with."
I had a 1977 GMC Jimmy (like the Chevy Blazer) until it was stolen in 1996! It was an incredible gas hog at 8 MPG! Several years before, I parked it and bought a Toyota Tercel. Didn't trade it in because it really didn't need to be on the road.
I think Duro was referring to the S-10 Brazer, based on the small, Chevy S-10 pickup.
Your Brazer was based on a Chevy 1/2-ton pickup, a much bigger and heavier vehicle.
I always liked the first generation Ford Bronco and searched years for a reasonably priced one.
An early Bronco would make a great toad and most of the parts are still available.
Evidently a lot of other people have the same idea, the prices have been very high for a long time.
The 1974 Bronco, that Greg linked to, is priced at $23,000. It's a nice beginning of a costly project.
It would be easy to have over $40,000 in it if restored or built up. That's too much money to have in a old machine that is going to be beat up, IMO.
As an alternative, a V-6 Ranger 4X4 is a similar vehicle that can be had for a lot less money and then built to the owner's wishes.
Being a contemporary vehicle, parts are readily available as well as off-road gear.
The newer small pickups, both the Ranger or Canyon, are heavier and bigger than the older versions.
They are not small, they are as big as the full-size pickups of years past, before pickups became mega-machines.
Larry
Larry I was referring to the first generation K5 Blazers 1969 to 1972. From the info I could find they are heavy but not any worse than many current suvs.
“Production 1969-1972
Class Full-Size SUV
Body Style 3-Door Wagon
Length 180"
Width 79"
Height 70.1" (2WD)
72.1" (4WD)
Wheelbase 104"
Weight 4000-4600 lbs”
Larry I was referring to the first generation K5 Blazers 1969 to 1972. From the info I could find they are heavy but not any worse than many current suvs.
More affordable in that case. A 4WD in Stockton, CA but with Oregon plates:
1969 Chevrolet Blazer K5 | eBay (https://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Chevrolet-Blazer-K5-/232629980391)
the old ones get heavy fast too. my bronco was slightly lighter than the earliest blazer, but about the same now with the extra steel on it (even with no doors and top). i made sure to do some extra work to the hitch prior to towing with the LD, but i can say it performs well.
Larry I was referring to the first generation K5 Blazers 1969 to 1972. From the info I could find they are heavy but not any worse than many current suvs.
“Production 1969-1972
Class Full-Size SUV
Body Style 3-Door Wagon
Length 180"
Width 79"
Height 70.1" (2WD)
72.1" (4WD)
Wheelbase 104"
Weight 4000-4600 lbs”
4600+lbs (with the hard top) of bare weight is a lot to pull. 4X4s get a lot heavier as you outfit them and add the stuff that should be carried when off-roading. Can't say I have ever seen a K5 used as a toad.
My Jeep Cherokee now weighs 700-bs more than the it did when it was stock and weighed 3300-lbs.
The K5 Brazers were based on the Chevy 1/2-ton pickup, just like the later model Broncos were based on Ford F-100s, and are too big and heavy for our LD's to pull, IMO. I think LD got it right when they limited the rear hitch to 4000-lbs.
The smaller S-10 Blazer and early Broncos both would make decent toads.
The S-10s were to not known as dependable vehicles. Their V6s had a lot of problems.
Larry
I posted last year (http://www.lazydazeowners.com/index.php?topic=31228.msg182466#msg182466) about our solution to take along a motorcycle and car. A small-ish Yamaha 250 on the hitch carrier and the Honda Element worked out well for us last year.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/jYuOH1SXs_2iNe67z_RmN6tWtYwVMARvFOuV9z0lFME_msJsYVN1TAxGCyoGQPlnHhlQjHY7wyAwihBuSLG1l0lxW3kz9qaRtYDVvvE49uCDdlgKTcqLSPjHp84YvbMB6yuoR2vRAJE=w1000)
However, as mentioned then - this only works with one motorcycle. When both of us want to ride, or if we want to take along a street and an offroad bike - we had to take the trailer. That meant giving up the car, which is not ideal for extended trips.
No more - we're gonna have it all. 8)
This year, our winter getaway will take advantage of a project I've been working on for a few months. I picked up a Ford Ranger a while back. Searched for a while and found a nice 2WD, manual transmission model with low miles. It's a great toad as-is, but after adding a custom aluminum flatbed - we'll have the ability to take two motorcycles while still having a toad. And, unlike the hitch carrier used previously - we don't have anywhere near the weight limitation which restricted us to one small motorcycle. Two large bikes, two small, or one of each. Whatever suits our fancy, and we'll still have room/capacity for gear. With two small bikes and gear, we'll still be well below 5,000 lbs. The truck empty weighed in at 3700, thanks in part to the lighter aluminum flatbed.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/8ZD6ZAboemwj6iVMBY84GfYrrmD73wTDtSqDJHpWPw2nbCYG_YwKuj8Xw4eBPMvvIT7P7SLZMm4J0TZzk6JY62h8QaNDU0ELWa3KfFVRW8nbLKnu4-RkQO-Grt6lvRHy7HHSfEAQB6c=w1000)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/6jniHxMfFI9q2nnYDS-ajSJmeDmIe0hHDxLRAK1OEDvGX5d3rFbB7-PAXizBRlIbef4uGoXVQzd5Efk5TifQKmK0O_Kf1ydULYo3AojCOqKz3WRo_qGVqn8MMSkCvkqRdf6KE_zLTDI=w1000)
Plans are to fabricate side rails that will double as loading ramps. And, with the flatbed having way more space than a standard pickup bed - it's 6' wide by 7' long - we'll have room between the two bikes to toss on one of those large, locking metal contractor job boxes.
It's not for everyone. But for those who ride, I'm hopeful it's a great solution that doesn't force the car vs. trailer decision.
Nice looking setup. Considerably shorter than the previous rig, too.
Sidewall/ramps are a good idea. If you can work out a way to have them pivot on the lower back corner, you only have to lift half their weight -- big swing-around space needed, though. I guess a sliding assembly would work too.
I see you still have the option of a rear platform on the truck, for those yard-sale buys you can't pass up.
I see the Weathergard pickup drawers on craigslist from time to time.
How did the Element do as a toad? Is/was it a 4WD version? (Don't know if you still have it...) Could its hitch handle a light motorcycle too?
Nice looking setup. Considerably shorter than the previous rig, too.
Yeah...the hitch mounted carrier is pretty deep, as it needs to be far enough away from the vehicle so the handlebars will clear. Then, you need another 12" or so for the ramp that gets stowed aft of the bike. After that, a hitch riser connects to the 2" receiver on the motorcycle carrier to make the tow bar close to level. And finally - I use the Readybrake system which adds even more length before the tow bar even hooks up. All of this required extra length for safety chains and light hookups as well.
For the Ranger, I'm also using a Readybrake - but we're looking to get a new tow bar with that integrated. The Ranger also has the tow bar mounts much lower than the Element, and in our case - eliminates the need for the hitch riser. So yeah...it will be a significantly shorter and less complicated setup.
Sidewall/ramps are a good idea. If you can work out a way to have them pivot on the lower back corner, you only have to lift half their weight -- big swing-around space needed, though. I guess a sliding assembly would work too.
I'm fortunate to have a friend who is quite the fabricator, so I've no doubt I'll end up with something that works well. Our current thought is to fab the side ramps so they are 10' long, with a pivot at the 7' mark. The 3' section would swing in 90 degrees on both sides, completing the 6' wide tailgate.
10' ramps give a very gradual incline to the bed, as we mounted it very low. Having two of them allows me to walk up one, while motoring the bike up the other. Since they will be aluminum, weight isn't really a concern.
How did the Element do as a toad? Is/was it a 4WD version? (Don't know if you still have it...) Could its hitch handle a light motorcycle too?
Elements make a fantastic toad! Absent our motorcycle desires, I can't imagine one better. With the rear seats removed and the cargo carrier up top, it gives tons of storage. Ours is a 2WD w/manual, so hooking it up is trivial. I'm not certain on the weight, but I'm sure it's under the 5K limit I've read exists for a stock LD hitch - even loaded with stuff.
But no - there's no way to carry a motorcycle safely on an Element's hitch. Hitch carriers are not light, and by the time you get close to 300 lbs. of bike on there extended 12-18" away from the receiver - that's way beyond the tongue weight capacity of the Honda. An Element has a towing capacity of 1500 lbs., which translates to 150 lbs. of tongue weight.
In fact, unless it was a very light dirt bike or small scooter, I'd be leery of using a hitch carrier on a stock LD hitch personally. Our LD hitch was custom made with added steel supports connected up to the frame by the axles. The previous owner set it up to haul a car carrier - something he never did, but we're glad to have that extra margin of safety when towing.