Would you miss your generator if you didn't have one? Can solar be a viable alternative to a generator?
While we do have solar, we'd miss a generator if we didn't have it. There are times we want to use the microwave or perk a pot of coffee. And then there are those cloudy days.......
For us the generator is a must have item. Although we normally stay in places with electric hookups. Sometimes we don't. And most important for us is while traveling. We travel with our dog and there is no way we will leave him locked in a hot vehicle. So when we stop at a store or other places where he can't go with us. We leave him in the coach with the generator and air conditioning running. Also quick stops at rest areas to have lunch we have use of microwave and air conditioning. We wouldn't have a motorhome without a generator. We also have a two panel solar system.
"Would you miss your generator if you didn't have one? Can solar be a viable alternative to a generator?"
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If you have solar, but no generator, you are at the mercy of Big Red's whims. If you have a generator and no solar panels, you are at the mercy of the fuel/maintenance/repair/smelly things/unspeakable noise gods.
We traveled/vacationed (longest trips were three months) quite successfully for ten years in a 1985 TK with 202 watts of solar and no generator - and no toad. We had two computers; one was a desktop; the other the first "laptop", and a printer. This was back before the turn of the century, but there was little else within the TK that required much electricity to function; no microwave, no television, no air conditioner.
Fast forward to today, and our 2005 RB has 400 watts of solar and a generator, but we seldom use either one because we don't travel much. But when we have done so, we did very well on just the solar. Caveat: We don't own an electric coffee maker (even at home - Melitta rules), and seldom use the microwave or watch television.
Our current record for not plugging in (nor dumping) is a week, but we did run the generator on a daily basis in the mistaken thought that the batteries should be topped to 100% at least once a day. If not for that action, we probably could have done quite well with just the panels.
On that subject, i.e. microwave use . . . what do members use it for mostly? Ours is used mostly for heating up the rice pocket thingies used to soothe sore muscles, or heating cold toesies. I rarely use mine, even at home, for actual food prep.
Virtual hugs,
Judie
I just finished a three week trip. I did not use the generator. Actually I can't remember using it while camping going back over to Feb 2012. When I go to Florida in the summer, yes I am one of those people, I use it to power the AC when pulled over in a rest area to eat or snack but that is about it. But that far south the campgrounds almost always have power available.
That said, I would never buy a RV without a generator. We have used the genie a few times when the house looses electricity due to storms taking out power lines. And on long trips a bag of popcorn is nice to have. The peace of mind that comes with you have it if needed is also good.
John
07 MB
Like many here on LDO, I infrequently use my generator. That being said, I wouldn't be without it.
Yes we have 2 solar panels and they serve us very well without any need to dip below 12.5 amps.
I have a standing rule...(and a constant reminder to my dear sister), If it can go in the microwave it can go on the stove or in the oven. Get used to it. This keeps the genny sitting quietly in its bay.
I'm not completely opposed to the generators use. Sweltering heat in a campground with no electrical hook up will send me straight to the start button.
My most recent trip to Zion had me pull a rabbit out of my hat. From home base to Watchman CG, the drive can easily exceed 11 hours. I never drive with the propane tank open. So the fridge is off while on the road.
This trip, after reflecting back on other LDO members use of the genny to run the coach AC for guest and pets while driving in the heat, I made good use of its power source to keep the chill on my fridge.
After 6 hours of driving I had my daughter start the genny and let it run for 1 or 2 hours while on the road. The ice cream stayed frozen my beer cold and refreshing once we pulled into Watchman CG in Zion.
The generator purred along with the road noise and you would be hard pressed to know it was running. Gas consumption was hardly noticeable. $6.00 in extra gas is a small cost to keep everything cold on such a long drive.
While in Zion, the generator got a well deserved rest. Watchman CG has electrical hook ups and generators are forbidden so no problem. And the microwave, sis, go right ahead and use it all you want and save my propane.
I love everything about my LD and that includes my generator.
As Tim Allen says, "More Power"!
Kent
Another factor about having a generator is resale value. A lot of potential buyers will want the generator.
We travel with our dog and there is no way we will leave him locked in a hot vehicle. So when we stop at a store or other places where he can't go with us. We leave him in the coach with the generator and air conditioning running.
There's something I hadn't thought of. My dog is everything to me, so a generator is a must have.
Thank you☺
Like many here on LDO, I infrequently use my generator. That being said, I wouldn't be without it.
If it can go in the microwave it can go on the stove or in the oven.
Sweltering heat in a campground with no electrical hook up will send me straight to the start button.
I love everything about my LD and that includes my generator.
As Tim Allen says, "More Power"!
Kent
What great information! I don't care about using the microwave either, but I do anticipate encountering sweltering heat. I could survive it, but my dog couldn't. I'd also forgotten that the fridge is off when driving.
I was hoping I might be able to make a LD sans generator work, but I'm thinking better of that now.
Thanks for the real life wake-up call☺
Another factor about having a generator is resale value. A lot of potential buyers will want the generator.
Well, that's a big one right there that I should have thought of. Between that, encountering heat and cooling the fridge, I'd be crazy to think I could survive without one. Just hoping to force myself into fitting into a LD vs. the other way around.
This is why I come to this forum. Thank you☺
The peace of mind that comes with you have it if needed is also good.
John
07 MB
That's just what I'm coming away with as a result of this discussion. Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it. You said it in a nutshell. Thanks John.
Mimi
Fast forward to today, and our 2005 RB has 400 watts of solar and a generator, but we seldom use either one because we don't travel much. But when we have done so, we did very well on just the solar.
...but we did run the generator on a daily basis in the mistaken thought that the batteries should be topped to 100%
Virtual hugs,
Judie
Yes, being at the mercy of the sun without a back-up power source wouldn't be prudent. I plan to outfit my LD with as much solar power as possible but, I realize that, when Mother Nature is involved, a little human technology can save the day. I love hearing how well you did using just solar. I hope I can enjoy the same benefit.
So, the batteries shouldn't be topped off each day? I guess that's a different conversation. I definitely need to do some reading about that in the forums.
Thanks Judie. It's good to know that with good timing, a good location and good weather I can boondock and be comfortable. Btw, I use a Chemex for coffee; very power friendly!☺
Mimi
Mimi,
Something to consider when checking out rigs with generators...how many hours are on the generator (total run time) in comparison to the year of the LD.
Less is not necessarily good. As a rule of thumb, I exercise my generator twice a month for one hour each time. For my RB that's a minimum of 34 hours on the clock. My LD is 17 months old. My actual hours are higher by a factor of about 2 possibly higher (I think I'm up to 60+).
So doing the math a 20 year old LD or SOB generator would do well to have at least 240 hours on it. That's only an hour a month.
Others here can certainly correct me if I'm off base but this just stands to reason if maintenance is done consistently. Otherwise issues may arise relative with poor maintenance.
Just sayin'
Kent
Mimi,
In regards to the fridge being off while traveling. The fridge and freezer will do well without power for up to 8 hours.
It is important to have pre chilled and filled your fridge a day or two prior to departure AND don't open it for at least an hour and a half prior to cutting power/propane.
Short trips without power are fine. But I often drive in excess of ten hours (wish it were less but I generally need to get where I'm going with minimum rest breaks...still a vacationing LDer ya know).
So no worries for short journeys just the long ones. I've yet to encounter a rest stop or supermarket with a level parking lot so running the genny/propane then just doesn't work for me. Fridges are expensive and fires are devastating.
Just sayin'
Kent
I wouldn't be without one. Saved me and my dogs when I broke down on the side of the freeway in the heat.
Langton
Several travel trailers, 3rd motorhome. Not a single one with a built in generator. I have a Honda EU2000 and have brought it to dozens of trips. Have used it probably 5-6 times. It is now in the garage with the fuel drained. I will probably bring it again this summer, and will probably not use it as before.
I like to camp either at altitude or near where a marine layer is likely to be so there is that.
No generator for us. We Boondock for up to 4 days on batteries then move on. When it's hot we plug in. When it's too cold for a couple of small electric heaters we move south. Our mode of travel is peripatetic. More than 4 days in a place, except the beach, makes us need to move.
We do have to visit the son at Twentynine Palms at any time of the year, but that entails hooking up.
When we had a dog and had to leave her (we worked) in hot climes I would not trust a generator to keep running, so it was living in the hook for us then.
Here's another vote for no generator. I removed the generator in our last camper and happily lived with a Honda EU2000. It is the best generator I have ever owned, reliable, quiet, and frugal with gasoline. It will run the microwave and a battery charger for the cloudy or rainy days when the solar doesn't have any output. It will not, however, run the AC.
Cost $1000 new. When it needs a tune up, take it to the lawn mower shop. No need to take the entire motor home to a service center.
When the power goes out at your house, the EU2000 will run your refrigerator and chest freezer and a few lights.
The generator in our Lazy Daze will likely get more hours doing bi-monthly exercise than it will being used in camp.
Just don't leave it outside at night, unless it is cabled, locked, and have a steel anti-theft bar placed inside the plastic cowling.
HD
Mimi,
In regards to the fridge being off while traveling. The fridge and freezer will do well without power for up to 8 hours.
So no worries for short journeys just the long ones. I've yet to encounter a rest stop or supermarket with a level parking lot so running the genny/propane then just doesn't work for me. Fridges are expensive and fires are devastating.
Just sayin'
Kent
Had no idea about the fridge other than the rig has to be level in order for it to work. I will be full-timing for about 1-1.5 yrs, mostly boondocking I hope, so I will be taking mostly short trips, staying in national parks/public land for 1-2 wks or so at a time. Soo, I can run the generator to cool down the fridge faster when I arrive at my destination (upon leveling), then switch to propane for the duration. Is that right? Fire from what? That sounds a little scary!
Although I "exercised" my generator each month, I actually used it mainly just for air conditioning, on occasion. Most of my camping was dry camping. I seldom used the microwave (except as a bread box) and didn't have an electric coffee pot. I boiled water for coffee.
Monica
Hi Mimi,
The potential risk of fire would be due to off level use of the refridgerator. When off level use occurs there is a risk of damage to the cooling unit (others here or a forum or Internet search can yield more details). Just stay level or moving when using the fridge and you should be okay.
The fridge will cool down at the same rate whether using the generator or propane. No difference AFAIK.
Kent
"The fridge will cool down at the same rate whether using the generator or propane. No difference AFAIK.
Kent"
Kent my experience with cooling rates is different. Our rv's two of which were brand new. The propane always cooled faster and brought the fridge and freezer to much lower temperatures. If I have ice cream in the freezer and running electric it will be like soft serve. But with propane it will be rock hard. I thought maybe I was imagining things. So I searched a large rv forum and the consensus was propane was faster and colder.
"The fridge will cool down at the same rate whether using the generator or propane. No difference AFAIK.
Kent"
Kent my experience with cooling rates is different. Our rv's two of which were brand new. The propane always cooled faster and brought the fridge and freezer to much lower temperatures. If I have ice cream in the freezer and running electric it will be like soft serve. But with propane it will be rock hard. I thought maybe I was imagining things. So I searched a large rv forum and the consensus was propane was faster and colder.
Ditto!
Duro,
That's interesting. While at Zion last week, I ran the fridge on shore power and while my Klondike Bars were as you said like "soft serve" my Ben & Jerry's were very solid.
On shorter trips with shore power if I'm looking for "rock solid" Klondikes which I generally prefer, I'll forgo the shore power and stick with the propane.
Gotta have my Klondike Bars.
Thanks,
Kent
A RV (absorption-type) refrigerator is a bit of an oxymoron, using heat to create cool. :o Here's a quick little primer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy1W-uWvR9U
(this is all personal opinion - agree or disagree it will not brother me)
First observation - I think a generator is a must. I use mine mostly as a monthly exercise to keep the gas fresh and the wiring rust and moisture free. In my case that's between 30 to 2 hours depending on the outside temperatures. When I use it its either to heat or cool the rig. I have used it a couple of times to recharge the batteries after a long overcast boon-docking trip.
Second observation - when getting ready for a trip we pre- freeze the refrigerator. On the road we continue using the propane for the refrigerator. We only turn off the propane when fueling. (<smile> Part of the fueling check list)
Third observation - it seems older RV refrigerators needed to be very level or else something would happen but the newer ones say if you feel comfortable in your RV then that level is OK.
Fourth observation - I have ask old timers and did the math - no one has ever seen or heard of a refrigerator fire in a LD. In fact using the stats that the lawyers use in suing the Norcold you'd be seeing a refrigerator fire at last once a month. Not saying fires are not happening just saying the number don't reflex the reality that I see. <smile> of course my reality is not anyones buy mine.
Fire from what? That sounds a little scary!
Several years ago there was a rash of RV fires caused by the refrigerator. Norcold took most of the blame but some Dometics fried, too, and both had recalls. That will give you something more to research!
The internal piping of a fridge has hydrogen in it at 300psi (I think). If the tubing cracks and the burner is on, fire is a possibility. Some fires occurred with the fridge on AC. Wiring shorts against the tubing, hydrogen is released and ignited. When an RV lights off all you can do is run. You can find a few pictures with just the fridge area burned but even those are totaled.
Whatever RV you get you will need to see if the recall has been done.
A search for "RV fires" will get you some reading if not videos. I suspect we "made your day."
The fire thing got me wondering. So I checked out what models were involved. Sure enough my 2002 was on the recall list. So did a little more googling and found what the recall work consists of. Mine has been done ✅. Now I feel better.😁
Had no idea about the fridge other than the rig has to be level in order for it to work. I will be full-timing for about 1-1.5 yrs, mostly boondocking I hope, so I will be taking mostly short trips, staying in national parks/public land for 1-2 wks or so at a time. Soo, I can run the generator to cool down the fridge faster when I arrive at my destination (upon leveling), then switch to propane for the duration. Is that right? Fire from what? That sounds a little scary!
Mimi, the vintage of LD you have targeted may come with a 3-way fridge, meaning it can also run off of the 12-volt batteries while driving. While not as efficient as propane, it is safer, IMHO, than having the propane on while driving in case you don't have a generator.
I never drive with the propane tank open. So the fridge is off while on the road.
We are the complete opposite: I always drive with the propane tank valve open and the refrigerator pilot lit. IMO propane is the most efficient means of keeping the reefer cold - at least in our unit, the pilot light boils the coolant more efficiently than the electric heating element from shore power/generator. (Older units with 12v are really inefficient IMO which is why I believe they aren't used anymore.)
I believe the primary concern with driving while the reefer propane pilot is lit is being involved in an accident where there happens to be a gasoline tank spill/rupture. In that case, an open flame would obviously pose a direct risk to starting a car fire and/or possibly causing the gas tank to explode if it reached that far. I've never really been in a major accident, and rarely hear of ones where gas has leaked (it's always coolant from front end collisions), so my risk acceptance considers those factors. As some say, 'YMMV'.
As far as generators go, we have a portable Yamaha 2000. We don't have solar, but use the batteries sparingly. I can easily bring the batteries up to full charge each day running the genie in 'eco' mode (at around 50 decibels) for around 1 hour. In eco mode, the generator can run for 10 hours on 1 gallon of gas. So, do the math: 1 gallon of gas = 10 days off the grid. I don't want to disparage solar, but it still poses no substitute to good old fossil fuels ie gasoline & propane.
Having owned a 1983 LD, without a generator, and a 2003, with one, I would not buy another without.
Why? Living in California, with its multitude of earthquakes faults, our LD doubles as our escape pod.
I want as much capability as possible, just in case.
After the Northridge quake, having a small generator allows us to keep the refrigerator cold for several days until power was restored.
This eliminated losing any food, unlike our neighbors who had to throw out the perishable foods they could not eat immediately.
Larry
"Living in California, with its multitude of earthquakes faults, our LD doubles as our escape pod."
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No warnings with "shakers"; I'm fortunate to be able to keep the LD next to the house, so I keep it gassed, the fresh water tank at least half full, the black and grey empty, the propane tank "full", and 4 or so gallons of "jug water" in a cupboard. We have little quakes all the time; just a matter of time..... :o
"Living in California, with its multitude of earthquakes faults, our LD doubles as our escape pod."
----
No warnings with "shakers"; I'm fortunate to be able to keep the LD next to the house, so I keep it gassed, the fresh water tank at least half full, the black and grey empty, the propane tank "full", and 4 or so gallons of "jug water" in a cupboard. We have little quakes all the time; just a matter of time..... :o "
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AND having heavy-duty shoes and a jacket grabbable by the bed for the race to the curb, hoping the roads will be passable.
I don't miss that part of living in California, but definitely miss the traveling around there!!! :-( So many memories - sigh : : : :
Virtual hugs,
Judie <-- Sierra Vista, Arizona
Adventures of Dorrie Anne | Photographing the West (http://dorrieanne.wordpress.com)
Today: Pizza Now - WOW
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"I'm not completely opposed to the generators use. Sweltering heat in a campground with no electrical hook up will send me straight to the start button."
Interesting thread here!
If you do any traveling in California's Central Valley, Redding, Red Bluff, Corning, Sacramento, etc., in the summer then you know that it can get hot enough to broil your brains! For instance, I like to stay over at Rolling Hills Casino on I-5 and you can park in the truck lot overnight for free. BUT, you will NOT survive the night if you do not have a generator to run the AC. You will be mighty uncomfortable and your dog will surely die. :'(
With our luck, we ended up traveling the length of the CA Central Valley last July - 99-110+ degrees. In fact we pulled into a campground with no hookups near Three Rivers about 6pm. Host said it was 114. My little thermometer hanging out the driver's window showed 120 when we parked, but maybe that included some engine heat. Anyway, we parked in the shade, closed all the blinds, and ran the generator for at over 4 hours to cool down the rear. Couldn't have managed without the generator for sure.
Re the frig, I precool it overnight before leaving on a trip and then run it on Propane while we're travelling. Aside from a few experiences like the above, when really hot we aim for hookups to keep it going overnight. We also tend to keep a bag of ice in the freezer. Not only do we use it for drinks but the bulk helps the freezer keep cool. Misplaced them on a previous trip but we used to also have several packs of blue ice to freeze at night and move to frig during the day in hot weather.
My main problem running propane while driving is remembering to turn frig off while gassing up. Any suggestions for reminders? Need something that will reach out and slap me upside the head.
"My main problem running propane while driving is remembering to turn frig off while gassing up. Any suggestions for reminders? Need something that will reach out and slap me upside the head."
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Perhaps a little laminated note at the propane tank that says something clever like : ??Fridge off??.
Don't forget the furnace. One time, during cold weather, we gassed up, obediently turning off the refrigerator, but neglecting the furnace. It had warmed up considerably since morning, and the furnace was not making heat at the moment. But as we pulled away from the gas pumps, the furnace sensed "too cold", and fired itself up!
Whew!
Virtual hugs,
Judie <-- Sierra Vista, Arizona
Adventures of Dorrie Anne | Photographing the West (http://dorrieanne.wordpress.com)
Today: Pasilla Burger
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For me, my generator is a tool. When I don't need it, it is just something I am carrying around, but when I need it, it sure makes itself useful. From late May to early September, I can get by without using the generator, PROVIDING I have good sky for my panels and I don't need to run any heavy loads - no air compressor, no charging my electric dirt bike, no microwave, and I unplug my DVR at bedtime (no recording a late night special event). With the generator, I am quite comfortable kicking on the air conditioning if I am in a heat wave, using the microwave, or charging my bike. With the generator, I can take a campsite under the trees. With the generator, I don't have to be miserly with electrical consumption on cloudy or rainy days. Bottom line, for me the generator is a valuable convenience, not essential, but something that makes my days more relaxed.
Ken F in NM
Bottom line, for me the generator is a valuable convenience, not essential, but something that makes my days more relaxed.
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Agreed; I seldom camp with hookups, and try to avoid hot/cold weather extremes unless I do have shore power, so, despite having 300W of panels, the generator can be very useful for those circumstances when only 120VAC will do a job.